Good Endings, Bad Endings, True Endings, False Endings

[rufiangel]

Hi! Jumping in to chip in my two cents.

It's interesting for me to read this thread because, admittedly, I am writing a VN where the endings are split between 'good' and 'bad'. But for me, the 'bad' endings are just as powerful as the 'good' endings. The only thing is that much of the mystery is left unsolved, while 'good' endings explain a great deal, if not everything.

'Bad' endings are simply consequences of certain actions (or certain lack of action, sometimes) that I think do a good job of reflecting the author's message and intentions. In other words, I think it's okay to say they're 'bad', to some extent. Not for the sake of making crappy endings, but really to reflect an intention with ramifications.

For example, in Katawa Shoujo,

sleeping with Misha is a bad ending on the Shizune route. It's obvious that the writer means to say that in complicated, emotionally tangled three-way situations, you shouldn't make it worse - you need to draw the line and stick to it. And that's pretty fair, I think. Though on a really personal note, Shizune's route was the most boring and I couldn't wait for it to end even when I got the good ending... ~_~

And in Hotel Dusk and Last Window,

instant bad endings occur if you select dialogue options that are too wishy-washy or too aggressive. It's a sound plea for balance.

Some of the best combination of 'good', 'bad' and 'true' endings, I've seen in X-Note and Area-X. Players have actually stated that some of their favourite endings are the supposed 'bad' endings!

Admittedly, Anon's 'bad' ending in X-Note is friggin' epic.

I actually sent a note to the creators, asking if they considered any one of the endings the 'right' ending, so to speak, since each of the endings were so detailed

and often very tragic

. The creators responded as thus (I am quoting word for word):

The game has many possibilities, and none of them is "canon", meaning no ending is more true than the others.

And I think that's a pretty good attitude to have if you want to create as many strong endings as possible to one strong beginning.

A creative selection of endings can be explored via the VN medium, so I think it has a lot of potential. I agree with a lot of what has been said in this thread, and also add my hope that no one feels limited by such labels, but rather uses them as a springboard to seriously flex some creative muscle and expand their story's possibilities.

[buttdumpling]

I think that Good/Bad/True endings have their place, but as preference? I don't like them much.
For one, I really hate replaying VNs. Skipping through text is boring, and doing all the little doodads to get a different ending "find all the feathers!" "pick up none of the feathers!" is annoying in any game. I'm not a completionist, so if the gameplay isn't awesome I'm not going to go back to get different acheivements or endings. And at best, gameplay elements in VNs are fun the first time. At worst, I look for a skip option. I think we (as players and creators) need to worry less about VNs having similar gameplay to other genres. I didn't play Dead Space for the romance, and similarly I don't play a VN when I want to shoot stuff.

The worst is when you get a "bad" ending by not saying the right things. I've gotten the bad endings of a few games because I picked the wrong conversation options (by being too sexual, or mean, or blunt) and they usually don't feel like real endings but just failure. And then it's like I'm being punished for my personality, like "oh you were too mean or said you don't like cooking, so everything goes well until the last chapter and then YOU DIE ALONE."

My favorite is when your ending really reflects choice (like in mass effect! my friend picked it up at 2 so he played a completely different game than I did! Or how being a mage elf made Dragon Age wildly different from playing as a rogue elf)
And I think this can function in even the simplest & fluffiest otome game. Say you can choose to be nice or mean to your bishounen boyfriend, so you get two endings: 1) you and your boytoy talk like you're arch-enemies, but that's just how you flirt & express your love. 2) you and your boyfriend have a super fluffy relationship full of sweet-talk. Both endings are 'true', and the different choices bring about different dialogue and events so there isn't a buttload of recycled stuff. Or, you have a third option where you murder him for his inheritance and become a black widow! (I'm rambling...)

I think coding endings can help a lot, especially for players who want to discuss the game afterward.

[SundownKid]

I like choice based endings more than "good" or "bad" endings, too. Having a "true" ending can devalue the story's message and ruin the "self-contained" story experience by forcing the player to replay the game. If you're going to have a true ending, make it additional but not changing the outcome completely. For example, maybe it shows what happened to James after he jumped off that cliff, but it won't prevent him from jumping off the cliff.

[Phersu]

True route is important for sequels, so you know which route the sequel takes off after. I prefer the Maji Koi routes, however, because they aren't really named per say as true or such.

[Akai85]

I get the point of "true routes" as the route that explains things and fills in the story. Doesn't apply as much to otome games though. Don't like True Route = Canon love interest because then it feels like the other romance options aren't real.

As for sequels to those kind of games... use different characters, seriously. No-one wants to have their dream couple undermined by a game they might have been looking forward to playing.

"False route" as in that wasn't supposed to happen, you messed up your fate, are fine. I actually think the name might apply better to bad end than some already labelled bad ends.

Then good and bad. Kinda irritating in a romance game unless the bad ends are actually terrible. Usually they're friendship ends which I don't consider bad or forever alone ends which are already annoying because there are other things to do than date. I know it's a popular gameplay element but forever alone endings are annoying!

That said I have a system where you can get two endings for a character - romantic and schadenfreude and in both endings depending on your choices you can unlock an additional "bonus" epilogue. In this case the stories are complete and self contained without the epilogue; it's just a bonus and not something you have to replay the game for. In addition there is a punishment non-ending caused by a player picking the wrong choices too many times (this would have to be a deliberate move by the player to ever happen) where your indecision causes absolutely nothing to happen and you don't end up changing.

In this case I guess the epilogues could be considered true endings and... I wonder if this system is okay...?