Lemma Soft Forums

Anyone here like this game overall? I know people have bought it, but the few players I hear anything from are those who only criticize it. That is useful feedback to an extent, but I also need to know what I'm doing right, too. I am considering pulling the game in the near future until certain things are addressed because going by everything I'm reading by random people in a couple places so far, you'd think this must be The Worst Game Ever (and it's not. )

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“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.”
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Me. And I mean the actual gameplay parts, not the VN content I wrote.

I like this game a lot, even though I'm not much of an action gamer. On Normal, most missions were challenging yet solvable for me (had to switch down to Easy only for one single boss fight), and the RPG parts made gameplay highly customizable. I went with defense and life upgrades in the beginning, then when I got better at dodging, I went for speed and firepower, and the "play feeling" really differs a lot. The mission length is spot-on most of the time (maybe except for one of the missions on the "true path", which seems a little lengthy for me), and the only way in which the gameplay could have been made any better would have been to make some of the levels more challenging to navigate, like with an indestructible background that hurts you if you touch it. (Classic games like Gradius come in mind here.) However, I realize that this would have made the entire programming part much more complex, so hey, this game offers a great package in other ways. (There wasn't much romance in Gradius...)

Really, I don't see why people shouldn't like Zenith Chronicles. It's probably that most of the feedback you get is from people who have a single issue with the game, and the feedback is mainly about that one issue. I wouldn't worry if I were you.

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Scriptwriter and producer of Metropolitan Blues
Scriptwriter and director of Daemonophilia
Scriptwriter of Zenith Chronicles
Writer for Pet Project II: Heavy Petting
More about me in my blog

I haven't finished all the paths yet but it's okay. I like the characters. The story started out as 'whoa, infodump' but I was able to ease into it.

I think it's just a crowded market out there with RPG Maker lookalike games (yes, it's a shooter, but it still has chibi sprites). Even the excellent character portraits have that pixelart feel.

Opinion of someone who has never played Touhou, and doesn't care to.

I don't think you have a problem either. I have my issues with certain things in the game but it isn't god awful bad.

Maybe the problem is marketing. Have you marketed the game in any other places? Sent out press releases? Have you sent out your game for reviews (aside from the animetric one)? Do you have an affiliation option for other sellers to sell your game? You should announce your game at IndieGamer Forums' Announcement section. They get a lot of traffic there, they're full of pro-indie people, and I think your game would receive positive comments.

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Well this topic has way too little replies, so I decided to comment, which is rare for me.
So I bought Zenith Chronicles and played it and here are my honest opinion.
The Bad (it is a general rule that if a game is bad, you start by pointing its ups and if a game is good, by pointing its downs):
Minimal worldbuilding. There are human, demon and faerie lands, but what we know about them is almost nonexistent. Even worse - we don't even know even the relative position of these countries to each other. I couldn't even imagine a map in my head while traveling. So, we are in Winterfall... is it far or near demon kingdom? human kingdom? where are the barbarian lands Dain talks about? We don't even see any cities. It seems that the whole world is made of barren fields for a dragon to wreak havoc. What about Lord Orowyn, is he an important person, or just a local lordling. It appears that we're given bare bones of the world and are supposed to work with it... which doesn't work. Hell, I didn't even understand that the world is named Zenith until Dain let it slip some time halfway through the game.
Minimal backgrounds. It seems that only a few backgrounds were created and the devs decided to get by only with them. So we get the same camp background for every rest spot and others aren't doing better. Limited amount of pictures do not allow to create a real feel of the vast world and rather it appears that the action is happening in a small secluded area.
Resolution. 800x600 might not be so bad despite it being 2011, but the problem lies elsewhere. I won't pretend I know anything about game making as I am only a player, but it looks like everything was made in 640x480 and only later resized to the desired resolution. I honestly thought that ZC was in 640 and it surprised me that it was not so. The picture lacks sharpness and it looks a bit washed out if I might say so.
Escape. No... just f-ing no. Don't ever make the game quit to desktop by pressing Esc. This is not an ePSXe emulator and pressing that particular button is very likely while wanting to call a menu.
The Good:
Gameplay. I'll be the first to admit that I suck at bullet-hell shooters, but I found ZC a profound fun. I loved missions as much as I loved the story and replayed them on different difficulties and trying to get the legends. Also your decision to extend the playtime by adding many bonuses for hardcore players is really admirable and doesn't look artificial. Plus having so many endings means that at least such a completionist like me will have a lot of work on his hands in order to clear the game. However you yourself must admit that it is highly improbable to complete many of the Legends on "hard" and if you say otherwise, I will have to pronounce you the God of bullet-hells. Also there is no consistency about difficulty. I found king Shade a pushover on "normal" in the last human mission. However I have beaten queen Faedra on "easy" only after about twenty tries in the last demon mission. Wtf?
Character art. I effing love the character art. Whoever did it needs a hug and a cooky. From the facial emotions to the clothing everything fits perfectly. All the girls are adorable and the guys' sprites fit their character well. I also am in love with Meredith
Characterization. After completing only one path I would have accused you of your characters lacking depth. But after finishing seven endings I applaud you. In order to see the whole depth of the characters you must complete the game more than once and every path will present to you an additional side of theirs to see.
The Weird:
Story. I'm undecided if it is good or bad. First of all I thoroughly enjoyed my journey through the Zenith. The story had many twists and turns I couldn't foresee and downright hilarious moments (fish from the sky, Meredith and sex, etc.) On the other hand some events had me in disbelief.
Overall I am entirely pleased with my purchase and I feel that I got my money's worth. Final verdict: 8/10.

Now some additional stuff.
How do I get Women of Convenience and The Righteous Trio endings as I have got the other seven and I'm only missing those?
What is the last bonus for getting 6 endings + 1000 Legend points? Is there some cheat to open that bonus without completing that requirement as I definitely won't be able to do it?
You have way too little advertising. I believe ZC is virtually unknown outside these forums. You should try to contact some video game news reporting websites or something...
You sell the game on toiletImpulse, but what about Gamersgate? Seriously, if your game was only available on Impulse and you had no direct sale from your website, I wouldn't have bought it.
After the "Canon ending" I got a "To be continued.." screen. That means you were planing a sequel. But obviously even for an indie company the probability of a sequel depends on the success of the original. So, how are the sales of ZC?

Thanks for the detailed feedback, beliar

You raise a good point about the perception of the world. There actually is a sort of behind-the-scenes map we have of Zenith (at least the parts in the game) but it isn't visible anywhere. As for campsites, it's all about stretching resources. The budget wasn't huge (indie game after all) so we can only do so much art. I'll always wish each scene could be a unique background As for the Escape key, that will probably be addressed in the coming update.

I'm glad you liked the various difficulties and optional legends! Yes, some of the Hard legends are extremely difficult (especially Destiny path final mission, don't get hit) but they are all possible. I've tested them out The good news is that you don't have to do all of the legends. In fact, there are over 3000 legend points possible in the game, and the most you need to unlock things is 2000. The key is to do the legends that give you the most points per amount of effort. Completing boss levels without using magic are good legends to do on Normal or Hard, for example. In the update I'm working on, the legend points are increased so that it will be a little easier to unlock more things.

Shade vs. Faedra difficulty: People are having more problems with Faedra than I thought they would. Her battle is more about strategy than Shade's. Basic advice: Use Alija, and Spirit Summon. Buff your attack and firing speed, and the level's a breeze Faedra has an anti-demon seal attack, so Meredith is vulnerable to that. The update will not make that attack as strong, though, so Meredith should still be a more viable option.

I'll pass your compliments along to the character artist

Story stuff:

Women of Convenience/The Righteous Trio: You'll need to be on one path and then switch to the other by doing the opposite. For instance, if you're on the evil path, start being good (don't kill fairies, burn houses, etc.) If you can change your alignment enough before a certain point, you'll get an extra option. Choose a certain option, and you'll switch paths and get the ending. Obviously you won't want to max out your evil/good points before you start going down a path, or else it will be hard to switch over later. Just be evil or good enough

The 6 endings + 1000 legend points bonus:

No cheats

The game's been selling pretty well considering that there's been virtually no marketing. I'm planning to ramp up the promo once the update is released, as it will make the game appeal to more players and generally be more awesome

_________________
“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.”
- Napoleon Bonaparte

I've retired from forum administration. Please direct admin/mod issues to PyTom or the other mods : )

_________________
Scriptwriter and producer of Metropolitan Blues
Scriptwriter and director of Daemonophilia
Scriptwriter of Zenith Chronicles
Writer for Pet Project II: Heavy Petting
More about me in my blog

After completing The Righteous Trio ending I believe I have found a continuity error:

Here's my take of things...

Story: VERY strong point. I like how thngs are not always what they seem, how choices affect the outcome, very well done =)

Art: I have one complaint, but it's a very minor one: Meredith's eyes. Initially she's all one color but channgs to more human eyes slightly later, is that intentional? Other than that, things are good here!

Battles: autofire makes this MUCH easier! Although, the boss fights are still HARD, even on easy mode, taking 12 tries to defeat the demon because I have a hard time dodging his normal attacts plus his magic...UGH!

I think my main complaint (outside of boss difficulty) is there isn't a *start from beginning* and *continue* button, just the continue button. Character development is a bit lacking, but I actually don't mind that, there is enough to keep me interested, and that's all I need!

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A friend is one that walks in when the world walks out.

beliar: Hm, I thought that was squared away, but I'll review the script again. Might be something to fix in the upcoming update Thanks for the heads-up!

musical74: Thanks Since a fair number of people have commented that difficulty is a bit much at times, the update will enable you to take more hits, as well as make some of the levels a bit easier.

_________________
“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.”
- Napoleon Bonaparte

I've retired from forum administration. Please direct admin/mod issues to PyTom or the other mods : )

Honestly, lowering the difficulty of two fights would be enough for me...



The biggest question I have is *who is the master storyteller?* =)

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A friend is one that walks in when the world walks out.

Did you try staying near the bottom of the screen for the demon's fire attack? That makes it much easier to avoid since you have more time to see where the fireballs are going to fall. (just curious)

_________________
“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.”
- Napoleon Bonaparte

I've retired from forum administration. Please direct admin/mod issues to PyTom or the other mods : )

Why, it's the Chronicler, of course! There's nothing special about him or is there? to be known.

_________________
Scriptwriter and producer of Metropolitan Blues
Scriptwriter and director of Daemonophilia
Scriptwriter of Zenith Chronicles
Writer for Pet Project II: Heavy Petting
More about me in my blog

I hadn't - although you are right, it does make it easier...Fairy Queen Faedra is still a royal pain though...not to mention (allies does help but still...)

Discovered that once you beat a bath, you get new opening pictures!

*Alija's Angels* -somehow I don't see Dain as an angel

(edited by Blue Lemma for possible spoilage ^^ )

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A friend is one that walks in when the world walks out.

Well, he has wings, doesn't he?

_________________
Scriptwriter and producer of Metropolitan Blues
Scriptwriter and director of Daemonophilia
Scriptwriter of Zenith Chronicles
Writer for Pet Project II: Heavy Petting
More about me in my blog