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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 9:48 pm 
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A teenage boy (or girl) has an uncle who lives in Japan who has recently gotten ill. The boy/girl's parents send their child there to watch after him for the summer. The boy/girl reluctantly heads to Japan without knowing any Japanese, and not knowing his/her uncle well. To make a long story short, the uncle enrolls the main character in a 1 hour-a-day summer school where he/she can learn Japanese. The other students at the summer school stay there much longer as they learn other things besides Japanese. The uncle also might teach the child some Japanese grammar every once in a while which could be a very emotional moment for the players because of how ill he is.

Other Major Characters:
A Japanese boy who attends the summer school and who knows very good English. He quickly befriends the main character and is a genius. He constantly mentions random facts which can be annoying. The main character wonders why he is at a summer school considering he is so smart.

A girl who appears friendly to the main character, however she knows very little English. She is often sarcastic and says what she thinks and wants immediately, without thought or embarrassment.

A girl who is a know-it-all in some subjects such as social studies, but awful at others like Literature. She is friends with the other girl. She is average at English, and okay at Japanese, but her main languages are Hebrew and Turkish as she spent most of her life in Turkey with her dad and Israel with her mom. Personality wise, she is a shy girl, however she often gets into lot of trouble with the police for pranks she does.

There is a mute boy in the class who you rarely see in summer school because he cannot speak so he doesn't go to Japanese class. He does Japanese sign language, and carries a notebook with him which he uses to communicate with others by writing Japanese in it. NOTICE: He is not deaf, just mute. He could have a small section (if the character becomes friends with him) where he teaches the basics of Japanese sign language.

The teacher is a female who believes in creativity and going at your own pace without being graded.

The assistant teacher, a male, feels very differently about this and is harsh and rude to his students. If the character gets to know him well (and has pretty good Japanese) they could learn about his backstory and how hard his life is.

Quote:
1. I guess the main character could be a college student/graduate who is attending a Japanese night school.
2. The sign language was just supposed to be a 1 minute "extra" which only has only a few words in it; nothing that needs to be incorportated.


Anyone else have any thoughts about this plot, or other plots?
If so, please feel free to post here or PM me.
If not, we could start fleshing out the storyline very soon.

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Last edited by TrickWithAKnife on Tue Mar 20, 2012 8:44 am, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 9:51 pm 
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TrickWithAKnife wrote:
Updated my previous post with some of those great ideas.

The second storyline has a lot of potential, especially with keeping the player interested long-term. Maybe someone with a closer relationship would work better, such as an obscure, possibly wealthy uncle.
Also, if there was some kind of problems involved, it could be more exciting. For example, the same message could have been sent to someone else, and the player has to compete against them.

I thought about having the money system because sometimes it's important to know if you are getting a good deal.
When I first came to Tokyo I was spending around ¥1,500 on lunch, not realizing it's quite easy to have a great lunch for less than ¥500.
Also, many people who come to Japan have very limited budgets. It would be good to show people what you can achieve on different budgets. This would also work in with the job hunting part. There is no motivation to get a job if you don't need money.

The health system isn't vital. I just want to find some way to make the player visit various food places, such are restaurants, cafes, supermarkets and convenience stores. In my experience, they all present their own challenges.


I like your ideas of the second storyline, especially the competing part. What about the wealthy uncle is (for some reason I haven't think about yet) looking for someone to inherit for example his possessions, house or company? But of course the uncle will choose the most suitable candidate.
The characters must show the uncle why they earns it and compete against each other. (maybe a score and ranking system with points which can be earned by answering the questions of exercises correctly? Maybe at some different points during the game a quiz or paper test to let the player review what has learned from previous scenarios?)

The main character, being one of the candidates, has to find his own way to live in Japan. I think he will be alone most of the time, or at least at the start of the game, to let him experience the awkwardness as you said before. He might meet the other competitors during the story. With some of them he might become friends and help each other, and with some of them become rivals and trying hinder each other. Since the main character don't know when the uncle decides the winner (probably at the end of the game), he has to find work to get money to survive and will finally go through all the scenarios.

And I think I get your point with the money and health system now.

@ jjbproductions:
I really liked your characters, I especially find the mute boy very original. If he can only write Japanese in his notebook, the player has to try to read and translate it to understand, which I think it's good for learning to read. But the story, I personally think it has to be more than just watch over his uncle during the summer. Maybe something after his uncle is recovered from his illnes?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 10:40 pm 
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I agree about the illness part. That would be good for a touching story, but maybe not so much for a fun game.

As for the main character being alone, that could partly be up to the player and their actions. Although I'll be referencing my own experiences a lot when building some scenarios, I don't want to tell the player how they should live if they come to Tokyo.  I want to show them what they might encounter.

I think the money system is important, but the health system isn't. Maybe I could find other ways to remind the player that they need to eat and sleep within the story. For example: "you look tired", "I feel exhausted", "my stomach is growling, and people in the train are starting to stare at me", etc.

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Last edited by TrickWithAKnife on Tue Mar 20, 2012 8:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:17 am 
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I've got a couple of ideas on the main story, but I'm kinda busy with something else right now, and it's gonna take quite a while to write what I have in mind, if you guys could hold on a bit


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:10 am 
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Sure. I expect we will still be in the discussion stage for a bit longer.
Even though I'm super motivated, I know rushing will just cause problems.

One important thing to keep in mind is this game is going to be massive.
Actually, even massive is an understatement. Fortunately for you guys, I'll be taking care of a lot of the mundane stuff myself, so you can focus more on the creator side.

Because of the scale of this project, there is a lot of opportunity for the general plot to change, and characters to develop more. On paper things might look sudden, but over the course of playing, these things could happen much more gradually.

Not only that, but we don't have to have everything perfectly planned right away.
There will be time to tweak the later game scenarios, even after coding the early parts.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:10 pm 
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I've been working on the programming side since announcing this project, making sure I can actually implement all the systems I mentioned on page one of this topic. So far it's going pretty well.
  • Money system is working.
  • System for tracking what the player has been taught and what they may have heard without being taught is working.
  • Inventory system is being fine-tuned now.
  • Many other small things seem to be working well.

Over the next 2 days I'm not working, so I'll start roaming around Tokyo, taking photos of various things that I'd like to put into the game. These won't be final versions, but should serve as fairly solid place-holders at least.

Just wanted to keep you guys updated. Wouldn't anyone to think I'm just sitting on my hands, expecting everyone else to do all the work.

Expected unedited versions in the next couple of days here: http://s1158.photobucket.com/albums/p602/CJinTokyo/
Password is ilovejapan

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Last edited by TrickWithAKnife on Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:27 pm 
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Neolem wrote:
@ jjbproductions:
I really liked your characters, I especially find the mute boy very original. If he can only write Japanese in his notebook, the player has to try to read and translate it to understand, which I think it's good for learning to read. But the story, I personally think it has to be more than just watch over his uncle during the summer. Maybe something after his uncle is recovered from his illnes?

Yeah, I agree that my characters are more interesting than my story. And the main thing about the mute boy was that you would have to know how to read Japanese to understand him, so I am glad you understood his point. :D For your inhereting story idea my main problem was that most people couldn't relate to (or like) a character who cares so much about inhereting items and money from his uncle.
And wow, the staff on this project has increased so much!


@trickwithaknife
Glad to see programming is coming along well!
Especially considering how basic I am with Python.
So any story ideas you favor the most? Could my character ideas be put into that story? Also, the link to the pictures you took is broken.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:15 pm 
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jjbproductions wrote:
For your inhereting story idea my main problem was that most people couldn't relate to (or like) a character who cares so much about inhereting items and money from his uncle.

Eek, my greedy nature is showing. :twisted:

jjbproductions wrote:
And wow, the staff on this project has increased so much!

Yeah, I'm blown away by the response. Although I spent a decent amount of time beforehand thinking about needed game features and testing out various engines to find the most suitable one for what I need, I only announced this project less than a week ago!
The recruiting post got a lot more attention than I dared hope for. Not only that, but 3 of my real life friends have asked me to let them be part of this project after I told them about it.
There is no reason why this can't be epic.

jjbproductions wrote:
So any story ideas you favor the most? Could my character ideas be put into that story? Also, the link to the pictures you took is broken.

I'd like to hear Astrane's before deciding on the most suitable storyline, but I do like your ideas. Of course even if we do use your idea there might be some changes, but that will all be discussed and decided here with everyone.
And some ideas may be able to be merged to some degree.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:06 am 
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Right...sorry for the wait. Hmm...it looks like my ideas are kinda outdated. I'm still gonna mention them anyway, since I already went through the trouble of writing them down, and afterwards try to draw some conclusions.

Quote:
One important thing to keep in mind is this game is going to be massive.
Actually, even massive is an understatement.


In this case, with a bit of clever tweaking, there might be a place for everything that isnt too disruptive. As side stories and such.


Here I go then :

Quote:
Or a story where the player received a letter from a diseased/lost/whatever person from Japan. Out of curiosity the character went there without any proper preparation and find clues about the person during the scenarios.



I strongly doubt anyone would, without any money nor preparations, leave his life behind, and go flying to Japan just out of pure curiosity for an email, when you recieve the most bizare spams every day. As for letter....if its from a random person from Japan....it wouldnt even make it to the border I reckon. Even if arrived, it would rise more questions, how did that person know your name ? why you out of all ppl on this planet ? its more likely to be a stupid joke, there are many jobless trolls.
Most ppl would just ignore it. . In the worse case, they'd contact police.


However, if that person was in fact a very close and important person to the protagonist, like his sister, it could work, even well.
He leaves everything he's on to and flies to Japan to search for her...where she used to live, what ppl she interacted with, also goes to police but they seem to be on a wrong lead, or refuse to share anything with him . He also meets ppl who offer to help him, like , maybe a very close female friend of his sister, who's just as affected by her suspicious dissapearance as he is , and maybe, some guy, with a very strong sense of justice, the embodiment of the japanese traditional values of a samurai, champ at kendo, who has once been helped by the protagonist's sister, and hasnt been able to repay that debt, now he wont rest untill he sees her in one piece again. Altho otherwise , he's a pretty silent and expressionless person, but with a very deep interiour, and huge valor. He prefers to stick away from the other two, and do his own search, but they eventualy end up in the same places, during the search.

The search would lead him from the mid of cultural festivals , to all kinds of places, and meet lots of other ppl, and make lots of friends on the way.

That, resuming most of the actual plot in a couple words. It would be a mature storyline.



Now for my own previous idea : instead of a bussinessman , the protagonist is ...

: 1. A young artist.

( So the plane has a defection, protagonist goes for a walk )....and on that walk, he spots some old colegue of his, that now lives in Japan, and they recognise each other. They were close way back, so she'll eventualy make him speak up about his misfortunes, and then tells him, that she's heard of excellent old artists, in that particular art style, who live in the countryside of Japan, and shows him a cool piece. But the thing is, they would never share his knowledge with someone who isnt good enough, and who wouldnt know japanese and have the manners and grace of a japanese.
The artist then becomes anxious to spend some time in Japan and eager to learn, and fortunately, his friend will lend him a bit of money, untill he gets a job, and also knows a place for him to sleep for a start.
And she also offers to give him some beginner's tips, she works as an english teacher, but she also started teaching japanese for total beginners, in a more unconventional way, altho she isnt very skilled at it either . This is where jibproduction's characters could kick in, but instead of the classical - wake up -> go to school -> go to part time -> sleep ; ....it changes into a more ... free and laid back environment.


2. : A young detective

...an ex genius prodigy, youngest detective ever, but now he's made a horrible mistake in one of his cases, and his career went downhill , and when on that walk, he spots a very dangerous criminal that escaped him a couple of times, and who's fault is that he's been demoted and in this pathetic state . He leaves everything to catch the damn guy and clear his name.

His search and questioning ppl will take him from traditional festivals, to the undergrounds of the japanese society , in his attempt to find clues about his nemesis, who seems to be plotting something big .
In his search will also be able to redeem his tormented soul, being touched by the incredible japanese culture, something like in " the last samurai "


But this would be much harder to implement, it would make the game exclusively story driven





------------------------------------------------------------------------





Ok, now lets see what changed meanwhile :

Your story with the uncle and the competitors is actualy quite good, its intrigue is simple and easy to implement. And the idea of a competition is also motivating. However, about the rich uncle.

Quote:
For your inhereting story idea my main problem was that most people couldn't relate to (or like) a character who cares so much about inhereting items and money from his uncle.


...I must admit i share jipproductions's feelings. But it depends what your aims with this game are, as well as what audiances you're gunning at. For the sake of a game which's main purpose is just learning japanese, it would work I think.
And with my ideas, I might be complicating things, just for the sake of a more dramatic story. Now that i go over what you've said again, my plots might look overdramatic, instead of focused on everyday circumstances. And the artist one, would be very apealing indeed....to artists

But back to the protagonist, maybe he's like that only in the beginning....and he changes on the way. Having some character development would certainly be a good thing.

But again, you said the scale was massive, so something could be pulled off, adapt whats good, and use it for side plots. You could even have different protagonists, in the same context, like in Ever17. Like, just as an example, have the path of the nephew and the path of the artist, and the artist's arc would be more focused on culture and manners. They could fly in the same plane , things happen in paralel, and protagonist and the artist to end up in the same class, even become buddies. But having different purposes. And at some point, you get to choose who you want to play with.

...but do we rly need different arcs just for that reason ?
Actualy the friendship between the protagonist and the artist could be just the thing that causes the first to open his eyes to japanese art; be that friend that keeps an eye, and tries to introduce him to all kind of cultural events


That way, even the original plane defection could be included....which, as an interesting observation, didnt matter at all for the guy going at his uncle since his stop was Tokio anyway ( and is barely even noticed by him ), but it had a major impact on the other guy's life, who ended up meeting his old colegue, and staying over in Japan.
Well...then again, this is just dramatic writter stuff, not how well this sort of thing is apreciated by western audiances.



and the artist's old collague could be an aquaintance, or friend of the uncle, and this is how the protagonist gets in that class. So she could become the teacher that jibproduction was speaking of
And like I said, she's offered to give some tips and small tests to the protagonist as well, in perspective of the test, that the uncle will give, as well as just everyday life.

The assistant male from jibproduction's idea, could be the kanji teacher, a friend of the -'artist's ex colegue' / now basic hiragana teacher -, since she doesnt know kanji well enough yet either, and she becomes a student herself at this stage.







.... oh, as a last thought, i even found a place for the detective's storyline in this plot.....the bad guy, who ended up causing him to make that big mistake that ruined his career , ...dont laugh ....could actualy be the uncle ! :D And the detective spots him, when he enters the car with his nephew , on the airport.... but the uncle has since, turned a good guy and regrets his actions, after he's gotten ill.

That could even be the reason the uncle calls for his nephew to inherit, instead of one of his old associats, he was a bad and cruel mafia guy involved in all kinds of crimes, but he's seen the wrong of his actions while he was being treated kindly in a japanese very beautifull place, like a hot spring station, when he was near death, he's seen the wrong of his ways, and he now wants to change.

So the detective could be a side character .
And while the player's enjoying his game , the detective's out there, gathering clues, only to make an entrance towards the end of the game, and deliver the twist !

...and for some mystery, you could change him to be the protagonist just for that little while when he's in the airport and ends up spotting the uncle, all in 1st narrative perspective....ofc the player doesnt know it yet...just for the mystery, give the player the sensation that there are serious things going on, from the very beginning



So that way, both the nephew, the artist, and the detective could be brought in the same storyline . And even the characters from the misterious dissapearance story . If the one that dissapears is actualy the artist's ex. colague....and the kidnappers could be some of the uncle's old associates, that are still bad....

....aaargh, this is madness ! Trying to merge all of the stories together . Well, i definately went too far .



Altho again, i'm not sure about all this dramatism, might not be the place for it in this kind of game. But, like you said its still early development phase, " no idea is too small or crazy at this point ", and it cant hurt for you to know how a possible main plot could look like. Its all here for you to check upon it.


Hope you arent completely confused yet :D


Last edited by Astrane on Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:21 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:14 am 
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Quote:
Or the character happened to be a unfinished pre-programmed android finding his creator. Making him a self adapting and learning robot haha.


Thats brilliant. I could see myself scanning the sorrowndings and gathering info with that robot visage, with info text poping up, like Terminator :D . I bet if this game was for japs, they would be thrilled by it, there are many robot fans in Japan. The guy might even become a national hero, if it was real


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:05 am 
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Quote:
I strongly doubt anyone would, without any money nor preparations, leave his life behind, and go flying to Japan just out of pure curiosity for an email, when you recieve the most bizare spams every day. As for letter....if its from a random person from Japan....it wouldnt even make it to the border I reckon. Even if arrived, it would rise more questions, how did that person know your name ? why you out of all ppl on this planet ? its more likely to be a stupid joke, there are many jobless trolls.
Most ppl would just ignore it. . In the worse case, they'd contact police.


Quote:
For your inhereting story idea my main problem was that most people couldn't relate to (or like) a character who cares so much about inhereting items and money from his uncle.


Yeah true, I actually got that idea from Silent Hill 2. Where the main character received a letter from his wife which already died several years ago. And which is a survival horror game ;p
And about the inheriting part.....I think it was my personal preference for not always good characters and obscure/dark stories. I agree those might not the most suitable for a learning game :lol:

I like your ideas so far Astrane, I especially find the different protagonists part and merging the stories together really very interesting gave me some ideas for my own game haha. But on the same time, it might be a bit too much for a educational game. The perfect balance must be found without the story overshadowing the learning part, because I think the story you write could be so interesting I would have played it even if it wasn't a language game :lol:

Looking forward for those pictures. I'm going to travel through Japan this summer. Not sure if pictures are still needed by then, but I will probably take a massive amount of pictures too.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:02 am 
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Which parts of Japan are you planning to visit?

What you said about the story becoming overwhelming should be something to keep in mind.
  • Firstly this is a way to learn lower level Japanese. Not just 10 survival phrases, but enough to live here for 6 months without many problems. Luckily I have a lot of experience with what vocabulary is needed for this.
  • Secondly it will serve as a kind of guide, so people who are planning to visit Japan for more than a week will be able to avoid a lot of problems, and also enjoy their stay in Japan more.
  • The story, art, gameplay, etc are the way to make this all happen, and to keep the player interested so they will play long enough to achieve those first 2 goals. Of course they are extremely important, but they should be built around the first 2 goals.

I guess I should suggest a few story ideas as well. They may encroach on some of the previous ideas.
  • Someone needs to transfer to Japan for their job.
  • A university student has an opportunity to travel to Japan through a student exchange program.
  • Someone was planning a short holiday in Japan with their girlfriend/boyfriend, but breaks up just before leaving. Seeing as they already have a ticket, and feel like they need a life change, they decide to do a working holiday instead.
  • Someone wins a competition with the prize being a trip to Japan. Because of bad circumstances in their life (lost a job, broke up with partner, other problems) they decide to stay longer.
  • A couple of good friends have come to Tokyo for an adventure, or whatever other reason (could use other ideas from this topic). This would enable us to use the friend as a kind of narrator, as well as a helpful study tool, by providing some explanations and reminders.

Took and uploaded some photos from Ginza (expensive fashion area) and Akihabara (Otaku/electronics area) today.
The photos are not great. I just quickly took some for testing purposes. I'll probably take some better quality night photos of Akihabara tomorrow.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:49 pm 
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TrickWithAKnife wrote:
Which parts of Japan are you planning to visit?


I'll be staying for 3 weeks in Japan.
First 2 weeks, I'll be staying at Tokyo.
I have a one week Shinkansen ticket. The last week will be traveling around with the Shinkansen, starting with Kyoto. :D


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:33 pm 
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Hello, welcome to Kyoto where I live :D

@ TrickWithAKnife
Mayb be this site helps to know how professional manipulate photos. They are using expensive tools though, some techniques can be used.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 10:39 pm 
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I actually have a lot of that software already, but I can't find how to get PhotoDramatica. A shame too, because it looks perfect!

EDIT: Just realised it's a guide, not software. Anyway, I'm playing around with it at the moment. My Japanese isn't great, so it's going to be a bit of a slow process. I'll upload a couple of test pictures today. Soon will be an indoor test. Later I'll add some outdoor pictures.

Anyway, regarding the storyline, I'm hoping we can decide on something by the end of this week, or start of next week. If you have any other ideas, or thoughts about existing ideas, now is the time to say so.

I'm about 50% of the way through setting up the journal system. It kinda works, but I need to tidy it up a lot so it looks nicer and is easier to navigate. This is a vital feature, so I'll make sure it's working smoothly as soon as possible.

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