Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

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Amiralo
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#106 Post by Amiralo » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:57 am

I can't unlock Blake's route!! do I need to do some other route before hand? ( I already finished crimson tyrant and reverse lies)
I followed the guide, but everytime when the talk to blake option should come up, it doesn't! (so I am forced to talk to raphael /lee instead)
Do I need to finish Raphael' route?

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#107 Post by azureXtwilight » Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:39 am

@ Snowjoker : Thank you very much! I really enjoyed your review :D Glad to know that my hard work isn't for nothing. You are the only one who can catch my drift well, and your interpretations are all correct. I kinda wish you've written about Shuang and Chunxiang too :P
Raphael is supposed to be a more dangerous villain than Lee, because even Lee won't kill Lucia or his big brother. But Raphael is willing to turn to people and switch sides easily. In the end, if you picked a wrong choice, he's even able to kill everyone. In fact, his death that Lucia mourns all the time is probably for the better.
Amiralo wrote:I can't unlock Blake's route!! do I need to do some other route before hand? ( I already finished crimson tyrant and reverse lies)
I followed the guide, but everytime when the talk to blake option should come up, it doesn't! (so I am forced to talk to raphael /lee instead)
Do I need to finish Raphael' route?
Yep.
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#108 Post by michi 18 » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:11 am

Are there any walkthroughs telling which paths which like ex. Raphael:.....
like that ?
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#109 Post by azureXtwilight » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:12 am

It's probably really obvious from the choices written in the beginning, but fine:
Crimson tyrant : Lee
Death of a Self-Proclaimed God : Raphael
Reverse Lies : Yuri
White Moon Reminiscene : Clifford
Broken Cresendo/The Unsuspecting Musician : Blake
End of The Inverted Soul : Final
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#110 Post by Feteo » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:36 am

I thought, I'll write down my first impressions. They may sound a lot more negative, than it really is in my opinion, but I usually stress out bad points over good ones. I will nevertheless finish reading the VN, and I usually don't do that very often, because I'm pretty much spoiled, when it comes to reading VNs.
I haven't read all of it. In fact, I have just started and I'm probably far away from the end.
Lucia confronted her doppelganger and then she got hit by those two invisible guys (?) and than Lee rescued her or something, although he seems to be a little bit evil... I don't know, have to read more.
So, what I think of the presentation:
  • - Artwork is okay-ish. Above average, but you don't read/play it because of the art. It's a good thing, though, that the art is complete and diverse, it goes well.
    - GUI in the main menu and options is pretty good, but somehow... a little bit exaggerated. I mean, the story is partly gory, but the textbox being all the time a creepy sort of saw-horror-batshit-crazy-stylized look just doesn't go well with the first days, when it's all about detention. Same goes for the NVL background. It doesn't look bad, but often enough it doesn't fit the situation.
    - Music is... well, the music is good, nothing I would listen to in my free time, but it is fitting. Problem: Usally always "breaks up" in the middle, instead of using clean fadeouts. Not cool! And you sometimes notice, when the track is being over repeated, which isn't that much of problem most of the time, but it could have been done better.
    - Sounds: Usually goes in the direction of below-average. At the beginning, when the guy drops his keys, there was no sound, but we are immediately greeted with low-quality sound of a door being opened. I don't know, they are seldom missing sounds, when the situation askes for some, but then there are sounds, which are just... bad or not-fitting.
    Let's get to the core, writing and directing/design. I can't say anything for the ending or the plot in general, but I can already say some things about the parts I have read. The writing is itself okay (I myself am not a native speaker, but I can still distinguish good from bad writing), it usually guides the plot pretty well. One thing, that really annoys me, is the too queer storytelling. You suddenly change perspective, which is never indicated by anything, no smooth transition or anything. The beginning is just like this, suddenly letters everywhere, something about a man, who is never discussed again, then we change perspective into Lucia asking herself wtf just happened, and after that the opening video comes out of nowhere... All of it just appears very rough and usually all of a sudden. The VN is pretty consistend, when it comes to that, always somewhat rough. If you haven't read Kara no Shoujo (「殻の少女」), I strongly advise you to do so. Just like Doppelganger, it has got it's perspective changes and switches from ADV to NVL-mode, but in a much better way than Doppelganger. Doppelganger is just too rushed in my opinion, no long dissolves, no kind of indication, when you change perspective and/or place/time. And if there is, it's usually to short. As for the writing: Too many f*cking plot twists. I have no idea, what's happening, the story dives just too quickly into all that sh*t. And not in a necessarily good way, because it seems like everybody is batsh*t crazy. Some of the plot twists are also pulled off too quickly, and "NVL-answering-problems-mode" like the identity of God Mode,usually leaves much more questions. There are better ways to create tension. Same goes for the feeling of time in the VN. Some days are somewhat long, other's are not that eventful and skipped very quickly, although I would have preferred some slice of life. Time just seems to randomly pass by or not, the feeling of time in the VN is somewhat crippled. The icing of the cake is the somewhat unreliable protagonist, who is constantly switching between "this is crazy, wtf" and "oh, Lee, I trust you and ignore the fact, that you are talking crazy shit". They just doesn't seem to be appropiate reactions, especially about the two invisible guys, Clifford and
    bitch's boyfriend.
    Lucia seems to be sometimes a little bit easy to frighten and fragile, but then again somewhat tough. Especially, when
    Helen (Ana's friend) is being killed or tortured or whatever and then rushes at her. I totally thought, this was a bad end, but no, Lucia get's into serious mode.
    That is not good character development, if you thought it was. The introduction to the characters is also usually rushed and the extensive cast doesn't really help memorizing all people and faces, especially concerning people with less screen time. Am I the only one, that find the names of most of the people weird? It's like they all are foreigners. Granted, Lee is of chinese heritage, but as for the rest like Jun...? Maybe, it has to do with the plot, but it really seems to be too much and unrealistic.
In general: The whole thing is somewhat meh. Art is (above)average, music is (above)average, writing is (above)average, everything is so (above)average. If it weren't for the "WTF happened?"-feeling and that mystery, I would not read it, but I really do want to know, how it is ending. The opening video is surprisingly good, but somewhat overloaded and the general consistent problem is the whole design. It needs to make more use of pseudo-animations like dissolve, especially when it comes to changing the location, skipping time, changing perspectives, and so on. Also: To many enigmatic characters
Sorry, to say so, but the only thing, that is not (above)average, is the art of designing and directing the VN, because it really is often enough... well, crap. I can't say that much for the story and the plot, but I'm pretty sure, that it will be... above average. I'll still finish it though and as I said, I'm spoiled, so don't think, that everything was (in my opinion) bad.
Last edited by Feteo on Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#111 Post by azureXtwilight » Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:11 am

Thanks for the review. I agree in some points that the timeline feels somewhat crippled and I need to be able to makes it flow better, and I know that my art-ability is kind of so-so. I don't expect everyone to like this game, and in fact I thank you for taking your precious time to try this one out. Although about the twists and so, it's because one path explains the other. I was planning for people who have one path to understand what happens in another path, then they slowly compliment each other. But if it doesn't work for you, oh well. It's not like I'm going to lose customers or something since no profit is taken. :lol:

One thing though, about the sounds and music and art, I need to remind you that this game is free, thus I don't have the money to buy high-quality music/pictures or hire someone, in fact I feel already blessed to obtain free music in such quality. So if you'd like to complain about that one, well... I can't say anything except saying I did my best.
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#112 Post by Nellie » Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:43 am

Wow Feteo! Constructive criticisms are usually appreciated, but the use of 'f*cking', calling the game meh or even 'crap' is hardly constructive, and can be quite demotivating! Bear in mind this is a HUGE free game, probably larger than quite a few commercial games, and is done by a SINGLE girl. Well, I'm sure you meant well, but it's just the way you phrase them can sound quite... harsh and demotivating! I'm not a native English user as well so sometimes I also failed to get across my actual feelings, but perhaps a more polite way of giving feedback might be nice!

Well... Sorry if I'm speaking out of place here... *poof*
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#113 Post by Feteo » Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:45 am

OK, I maybe exaggerated on the point with the music: Well, the music was fitting, it was good. (And everything below good in the music industry is usually crap, because: Mess up one tone and everything is sh*t.) The problem is more, how you as the director dealt with it: No clean transitions regarding the music. And sometimes the music changes too suddenly. (As for anything in the VN...) I really mean it: Work on the design and presentation, watch other professional visual novels, that wasted millions of yen and try again, because I'm in fact sure, that you can make good visual novels. You have got all the ingredients and even if some of them aren't top-notch: The greater problem is how to mix them in my opinion, therefore direct the game.
But oh well, we are talking about the upper-league. Most free Visual Novels play like shit, so I usually don't bother writing anything about them (and weeaboo.nl usually expresses my thoughts), but your VN is seriously a case of: "If it only felt smoother, it could have been one of my favourites!" ;)

And by the way: Hinamizawa Syndrome. ;)

@Nellie: I know, but since everybody seemed to cherrish that game, I wanted to be the opposite: As I stated, there are many good things, but I clearly wanted to point out the bad ones, so that she can improve, because... I believe in her. (Hard gay, but whatever. Or wait, she's a girl?)

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#114 Post by okiness » Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:10 pm

I will say this, I'm still in the prologue! It's so long!

But one thing though, two actually:
1. I really respect how far you've come with your artwork. If you'd ever like some help, such as redlines or anything, I really appreciate your effort and respect you. You grew way faster than I did!

2. Great usage of music. That intro. . . my boyfriend was super super impressed. So was I!

Girl, this game should be commercial. Seriously. At this point, just make it commercial! You deserve it. Or at least open donations I feel so bad about playing this without paying >_<

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#115 Post by Snowjoker » Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:25 pm

*sigh* When someone makes a request, one can’t help but accept. So yes, I have a few minutes free and as you wish, I will try to analyze the Shuang and Chunxiang. Although these two are both similar but very different at the same time. (makes no sense? My opinions ahead if you wish to know the meaning behind my thoughts) Of course they're spoiler tagged for obvious reasons for those who haven't played the full game yet
Shuang: First meeting with her, she’s a simple girl in a wheelchair. She seems to not know much about the outside world and to me, I just made an assumption that she’s probably idealistic based on her talks about dream and hope later on. Truthfully, I didn’t think that much about her except that because she was handicapped (and being a bit knowledgeable about the Chinese culture), I did realize there’s a possibility for some problems to happen in her family (after all, there’s always a reason for each character’s traits and defects in any story). However, I think the main thing I overlooked was that 1) Lee was definitely not the kind brother he was pretending to be while with Shuang in front of Lucia 2) her simplicity and her pureness was what made her become used by those around her. She’s interesting when you get a glimpse at the conversations between her butler and her. After the first playthrough (where it ends with Shuang talking to Chunxiang and her butler) we already get the feeling that there’s more than meets the eye, when you return back to the scene where the butler is talking to Shuang (obvious by the hint of him calling her milady), then you can see there’s some type of control being exerted over her by the butler when he tells her that Clifford no longer wants to see her (been a while since I really pay attention to this scene but yeah, something like that if I recall).
So, in the end, Shuang’s character does develop into one where she’s more aware of the outside world and that was a big part in determining whether she finally knows who’s truly able to be trust. You just can’t hate her because of her type of purity: oblivious to the outside world and also very idealistic. Most people wouldn’t have the same view as her to try to make everyone happy which she believes she was doing correctly by using the doppelgangers because truth is that people these days care more about themselves than random strangers on the street. Shuang could almost remind me of some of the pure type of heroines I’ve seen in other anime shows but now I’m getting off topic. The only problem with her personality which is good and bad at the same time, she can trust people too easily and being raised not seeing the outside world, she wouldn’t have knowledge about manipulation or the other darker aspects of life. Well, she didn’t even know about bullying so I’m assuming she has a pretty bright and happy world in her mind with ponies and unicorns.

And now I talked too much about Shunag let’s go to Chunxiang
Chunxiang: This is just me but this girl was basically giving me the vibe of suspicious and the feeling of something’s-not-right just from the beginning. I mean, she’s albino, has red eyes (ever read the Tvtropes on that?) AND she’s in a hospital for special patients! But if I was Lucia, of course her way of thinking of Chunxiang is a nice girl is perfectly normal since I do realize that these are just stuff you pick up through anime and etc. Going back, she does seem nice and most of the time, during the first few paths, you get a glimpse at her crazy side but nothing about how she got there. The only hint I really got was that she hates Lee for something he did and the plot kind of stopped at just that until the final endings where we get a better picture of what happened between them. First of all, this girl is definitely not insane to begin with but it was insanity developed because of what happened in her relationship with Lee. Her main conflicts and her behavior were all in fact Lee’s fault if we think about it. Again, this is probably on purpose to show that not only is Chunxiang a very devoted girlfriend and too good for Lee but the guy’s so twisted that he even corrupted his own happiness. He’s so obsessed with loving someone but he doesn’t even understand what that means to be loved and return love. I won’t say she’s pitiful (she dd kill people so it’s hard to feel pity for an insane character) since she has become a pretty psychotic person but her descent into madness is very logical in the sense that it wasn’t her fault. In other words, I guess the best way to describe her is that she’s not a terrible person but rather in the grey area between good and bad. Her actions of not telling Shuang about Zhuang might be wrong but also logical in the sense that she would obviously put love in front of friendship when her last time being heartbroken ended up in her going crazy. In the very first scene showing her of black and white, this is probably the best way to describe what Chunxiang wanted: happiness with her loved one. And does she get that even in the end? No, it’s because her loved one unfortunately turns out to be someone who is the mastermind of this whole thing so it’s perfectly normal for her next reaction to be going crazier. As you can see, there is one ending where we assumed happily ever after until she kills Lucia because the whole point is that she once again lost someone important to her and since no one did anything about it, she couldn’t bare it but unleash her anger onto the cause of all this mess (Lucia being one of those people). But in the true route, we do get a hint that she perhaps is still in love with Lee and since her other boyfriend/lover Zhuang is dead than she moves back to the past and seems to be trying to redo things with Lee again. This time around, she still has her craziness but I think that side of her was what helped her realize that perhaps there is a chance with Lee since she’s turned out like him in the end (a bit twisted and definitely not sane).

And bringing them together since I seem to be someone who can’t write one sentence and be done with it, the two characters Chunxiang and Shuang are similar on the outside. They both seem to be nice girls and caring. They both help Lucia with her problems in some part of a couple of the routes. If I remember, it was mainly Shuang who gives Lucia advice but I think also Chunxiang in one of Yuri’s (?) route, forgetful here. Even though Chunxiang is always saying she and Lee are Yin and Yang, I get this feeling that it relates more to Chunxiang and Shuang. These two are the ones who are truly different. As mentioned, they both got hurt by their lovers but of course, one being more traumatically hurt than the other. However, their way of thinking was also very different. After being dumped, Shuang only wished for other people’s happiness and not her own but Chunxiang is the opposite. She was searching for her own happiness and didn’t care about others at all. They could all suffer for all she cared if that means being happy with that one person she replaced Lee with (zhuang). And I’m contradicting myself here but I believe that it is likely that those two could have both become very kind and caring people and that did happen to Shuang in the end when she was finally with Clifford but on the other hand, Chunxiang was beyond that the second she was made insane by Lee. Therefore, different and similar at the same time, these two were very interesting characters as a whole.
Again, TL;DR but feel free if you’re curious, bored, want to be entertained, etc~
A small edit since I forgot something and just remembered (cause everyone does that sometimes)-- your game is definitely deeper than what's on the surface and I've played otome where they're shallow (also good but usually not too remember-able) so it's normal that not every reader will understand every bit of it but seriously, as the overall picture, it's definitely something that makes an impact on one's memory once the entire storyline is put together and understood (that just means I'll remember your game if someone ever brings it up years from now and be like 'yeah, that was one of the best english-made otomes I've played' or something like that)

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#116 Post by Riku » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:09 pm

I agree with both Feteo and Nellie.

Yes, she is a girl alone making a HUGE free game.

However, I think it would had been better if she'd makes the game shorter, because a visual novel of that length is not the best thing to do with a just single person working on it. If it had been shorter, she might had some more time to working on polishing the details that had not been refined, such as those Feteo noticed. For example, instead of having over 80 sloppy and quickly done CGs you can have 30 CGs that we can see that you really put efforts on it.

Remember that, sometimes shorter can be better!

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#117 Post by Maylen Rose » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:18 pm

Hello, just wanted to say that I really enjoyed your game. Thank you for all of the hard work you put into it, I really loved the game. The music went really well with the scenes which really sucked you into the game even more. I enjoyed the storyline immensely, and I must say that your characters really left a lasting impression on me, and they even encouraged me! Thank you again for the lovely game.

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#118 Post by okiness » Wed Jan 16, 2013 3:13 pm

Uggggggh.

Let me come in on this and say, have you guys been paying attention? Like are you seriously thinking she did all of this super rushed? Her art has actually MASSIVELY improved. The critique has come off super harsh, and she's done a whole lot of work for not much in return if all we can do is complain.

Ace job, girlfriend. I'll give a constructive review later, but I've finished it now and we'll see.

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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#119 Post by azureXtwilight » Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:54 pm

@Snowjoker : Thank you very much! Sorry for being demanding, hehehe~
@ Riku : Sadly I can't XD If I make it shorter there will be a more massive plothole than it already have, then there will be more complaints. The pacing is already kinda rushed enough.
@maylen rose and okiness : Thank you very much! :D It's okay. I accept praises and critiques alike, makes me feel that someone actually cared enough about this game to even comment.

Edit : I guess I was ranting. I'll try to minimize it as much as possible. It sounds really unprofessional
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Re: Doppelganger : Dawn of the Inverted Soul [Guide up]

#120 Post by DreamDragonHatchling » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:51 pm

It is almost 4 AM and I have finished all the endings ;3

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