The 2008 Lemmy Visual Novel Awards - Results now posted!

[chunderbunny]

also, I realize I probably don't have a real shot at any awards (unless some random "VN developed in under a month" award comes out), but I'll be interested in what the results are.

Well we do have the NanoReno event in the Spring traditionally, although I don't think I've ever seen anyone try and claim which entry was the 'winner'. This is probably for the best since having a winner might discourage people who use the event as an impetus to make their first game (they may be lacking confidence in their abilities).

[Megaman Z]

and the lack of any "winner" is part of the appeal of the NaNoRenO, IMO.

[sake-bento]

A graphics award would be nice but it's kind of superficial.... but hey, who doesn't like eye candy? ; )

Well, since we're awarding the "novel" part in terms of good writing, I think the "visual" part also should get a nod. Just my own crazy thoughts, though. ^_^;;

[rioka]

True. But if there will be any Visual award in future, I would prefer it be in terms of directing - how the scenes were played out, setting the tone, did it pull you into the story, etc rather than just great artwork or visual effects. Anyways, I'm looking forward to seeing the nominations. : )

[sake-bento]

Well, it could be something like use of visuals, rather than artwork. That way someone who comes up with a really unique style (I recall someone once used photos of dolls for their characters) will also be considered.

Either way, I'm playing through most of the stuff I missed in an attempt to be a good nominator person.

[Blue Lemma]

Maybe next time we'll have a visual award, but I think the judges will have our hands full with these five for now It's a good idea, though.

(Nominations are now until the 20th!)

[monele]

For people like me who have a bad memory ^.^ :

http://lemmasoft.net/lemmys/lemmys2008.html (full rules)

Nomination rules :

Right now it's time to nominate your favorite visual novels and visual novel-type games! If you are registered on the forums as of December 5, 2008, send Blue Lemma a PM (private message) with up to 2 nominations for each category. You can nominate fewer than two for each category, but you may only send one nomination PM (so no adding more later and filling my inbox!) Make the subject line "Lemmys" so I can pick the messages out easily, please. Nominations will be submitted between January 5, 2009 and January 20, 2009, after which there will be a vote on the final winners.

[mikey]

One question (actually, three):

Is it possible to nominate and/or vote publicly (in this thread, conveniently)?

And if not, can one reveal his nominations (if one wants to)?

And, will full results be revealed publicly? (especially let's say a list of nominations, complete with games which got just one nomination)

EDIT: Oh, one more: Do nominations count as equal, or does Nomination Nr.1 give somehow more points than Nomination Nr.2?

[Blue Lemma]

Is it possible to nominate and/or vote publicly (in this thread, conveniently)?

Please send a PM instead

And if not, can one reveal his nominations (if one wants to)?

Sure!

And, will full results be revealed publicly? (especially let's say a list of nominations, complete with games which got just one nomination)

Probably not, because that might be a little sad for the games that get zero nominations

Do nominations count as equal, or does Nomination Nr.1 give somehow more points than Nomination Nr.2?

Nominations are of equal weight, in no particular order

[monele]

Probably not, because that might be a little sad for the games that get zero nominations

Well... if you get no nomination, you're not in a list of nominations to begin with, so it should be okay, right? ^^;

[mikey]

Well... if you get no nomination, you're not in a list of nominations to begin with, so it should be okay, right? ^^;

Well, I thought it was like this: people send in names of nominated games (let's call it nomination votes), and whichever let's say 5 game have the most nominations are the 5 actually nominated for that category. So it would be Game A (45 people sent nomination PMs with its name), B (40), C (35), D (30) and E (25). But then, there is Game F (11 people sent nomination PMs with its name), Game H (7), Game J (2), and so on, and these will not make it to the 5 actual nominated for which there will be a vote. So if Game F will not be in the top 5, people will not know whether it got 11 votes, or even zero.

But to be honest, I don't quite understand the purpose of the nominations, why not just send your top 3 picks in each category, count the numbers, make a list - top game wins?

[monele]

I see what you mean now and I'm not sure what my opinion is about this ^^;.. Maybe it would be nice to at least name games who got at least 1 nomination... but then it would be easy to know which ones were not nominated at all. In both cases, there would be sad people?

[mikey]

I'm also worried about frustration. Say I nominate some games, they won't have enough people behind them to qualify for the main voting round - so what should be my motivation to participate in the actual voting, then? Just to force myself to pick a game out of the existing candidates when my heart is with other games? And taking a step back, if I know that I like a game that isn't one of the big guns, I logically don't have a lot of faith that my voice will make a difference.

[EwanG]

Sounds like there's a desire for a "People's Awards" group of awards that are voted on in addition to the ones that are going to be judged. Since the forums support adding polls, I don't see anything stopping someone from setting that up if they'd like.

[mikey]

Sounds like there's a desire for a "People's Awards" group of awards that are voted on in addition to the ones that are going to be judged.

As for me personally, I don't really feel like awards are necessary, and I've probably said this many times on the forums on various occasions. But:

Since the forums support adding polls, I don't see anything stopping someone from setting that up if they'd like.

But then, setting up a separate awards system is just undermining the authority of the Lemmys - and since those are already in place, it would be counterproductive to invent other awards. So the best way is to try to make Lemmys as good and representative as they can be. Even if there is no People's Award this year, I'd say it's better to wait a year and submit the idea as an improvement, rather than setting up something in parallel. I don't really know how I should feel about the Lemmys, but one thing I do know, I don't want to sabotage them or anything. And I'm thinking that a People's Award, even though it would be meant well, would perhaps have that effect.

I do have a hard time with the categories - there is for example no "romance" category, and no "little game" category, both of which are hugely relevant considering the types of games produced. Some people rightfully wanted a "visuals" category, and then I think that for example a "most recommendable" category also makes sense - the sort of game that you would actually give to your friends. But again, nothing that can't be discussed for next year.

The problem I was talking about was not the content, though, it was the process. Basically, from what I understood, there are 2 phases:

Phase 1: People nominate (via PM) and the most-time nominated games in each category get to Phase 2

Phase 2: People vote and Experts vote from the games selected in Phase 1. Results are decided with 50-50 weight.

My point is not Phase 2 (that seems reasonably just), but Phase 1 - fearing that the process in this Phase 1 is too selective. Such a preliminary phase of nominations makes sense when there are hundreds of games, and the ones that make it to Phase 2 can already be considered awarded (much like the Oscars, when if you're a nominee, that's already a great achievement). Here, with this little number of games to choose from, all the process will do is reduce the number of games that can be voted for. And if you keep in mind that (also my guess here) the Experts vote is there to prevent the most popular to automatically win, actually since experts don't nominate with the same 50-50 strength (at least there is no mention of that), the popularity factor will determine which games they can even consider. So actually also the power of the 50-50 Experts system on voting in Phase 2 is being really limited by the selection via the nomination process.

Though I have no real insight into the actual figures at the moment, so it's quite possible that the system actually works in practice. I do look at it from the theoretical side, admittedly. To be practical, my suggestion would be to skip phase 1 and let any game participate in phase 2 if that is still possible at this moment, but if not, well, then the world will not end, of course.

And, so that I'm not all negative, here is a practical list of all games in 2008. I was going to criticize the lack of such a list (at the very least, I'll suggest it be prepared for next year and posted with the announcement), but I don't want to be all mean. Today is a nice day, after all:

Code: Select all

Another Day
Answer, The
Attorney D
Be My Master?
Bounce
Broken Sky
Case Of The Missing Bracelet, The
Childhood Friend, The | Project SVN
Comiket Adventure
Cyber Troops Vol 1
Dark Carnival
Dream Chasers
Dream Savior Gakuen
Dreams Of The Skies
Escape from the Witch's Lair
EVE 
EVEning Course
Flower Rabbit | Snow Rabbit
Forget Me Not
Fucking Question, The (Watered Down Version)
Heart Of Fire
Hikkomori Quest
Hikkikoomori RPG
Idolcraft
Lady Sugarplum's Bad Day
Limitless Fire
Little God
Nerr2Babe
Next Station
One Million Kisses
Raidaa No Asahi
Real | Doll
Real Life: A Bishoujo Adventure
Ren'Ai Blogger Project
Ripples
Road Ahead, The
Rutabega, The
Scapegrace | Komarimono
Shinsei
Snipe Me, Author-Tan!
Songs Of Araiah
Star Story Saga: Renaissance
Test Of Courage, A
Tokyo Conspiration
Trepanation
Tying Threads
Ursa And Parka Cord
White Poplar
Windy Capital
Wings 2
Xalynne's Twins
Yaruge Girl Triona
Yuki No Imouto

The list doesn't include the remakes os Season of the Sakura and Ring Out - also, no Fest Trip / To&Hi since it's in a foreign language, and just the freeware games. Be advised that some of the games are preludes to larger planned works. It's best to play and decide.