Wedding Vows (Calling for artists again!)

Ideas and games that are not yet publicly in production. This forum also contains the pre-2012 archives of the Works in Progress forum.
Message
Author
User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#31 Post by Mihel » Thu Jan 18, 2007 12:33 am

Wow, sorry about that. This winter vacation didn't turn out the way I expected at all. Right now, the music for Wedding Vows is second in line behind my work on Foxtaile, but since TaleWeaver pushed the deadline back I can give more time to you :)

At the moment, I have actually already done some work. I've come up with some original thematic material and I've updated and re-synthed up my very own arrangement of The Canon in D (which, incidentally, includes a whole page of music - about a minute and a half worth - that many commercial recordings leave out).

I also had an interesting idea, as an effect: intersperse the full-quality sound with a vinyl-record effect. Since I can't attach files to PM's I'm posting the samples here in one bigass zip file (if it's too big, please say so). It's the plain synthed Canon (wv-canon.mp3) plus a very sloppy job of mixing it with a vinyl effect (wv-mix.mp3).

All in all, I am still with you, I'll send a couple samples of original stuff soon (hopefully in the next week, if not the next couple of days). I too would love to see it released on St. Valentine's Day, since I hate to cause delays. I'll be on it pretty diligently from now on :)
Attachments
wv.zip
(9.4 MiB) Downloaded 75 times
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
dizzcity
Veteran
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:51 am
Projects: Lakeside Sunset, Wedding Vows, Working Woman
Location: Singapore
Contact:

#32 Post by dizzcity » Fri Jan 19, 2007 9:22 am

Great job Mihel! I love your interpretation of the Canon. :) It's all I expected it to be and more. Just a few things, though:

1) I noticed that the strings that play the highest melodic line sound a little too electronic and 'synthed' for me. The rest are fine - they sound great, in fact - but the highest-pitched string instruments seem like they're generated from a keyboard and a little too 'hard' or 'edgy' for a 'soft' piece like the Canon, if you understand what I mean. I'm not sure how to explain it, because this is based more on a feeling I have than anything else. Would it be possible to use another instrument that has a 'softer' tone or timbre to play the high melodic line?

2) Having a vinyl record effect would be interesting... but I'm not sure how to convince the readers that the sound quality is deliberately made that way, and they're not just hearing things. To be honest, the first time I played the mix version through, I thought my speakers were having trouble because of the random bursts of static that came. Only later, when I re-read your post, did I connect it to the vinyl record effect. I'm just worried that other readers who don't know what you've set out to achieve may mistake it for just poor audio engineering instead of a deliberate effect. But, as you said, it was a sloppy version. Maybe a more polished effort might be able to show more clearly that it is deliberate? I don't know...

Still, those are two just minor things. I really like your music and what you've done so far. Each piece is a near full 7 minutes long - that's incredible! We may need to think about how to shorten the pieces a little in order to fit the sections - many of which take only 3 minutes or less to read. Or maybe I can just have the music constantly playing throughout the game in a set playlist instead of assigning specific themes to specific chapters. I don't know... what do you think? I'm still fairly new and inexperienced at sound and audio.

-Dizzy-
A smart man follows the rules, a dumb man breaks them. A great man bends the rules and thus creates them.
Fanfiction.net Profile.
Writer and director of Working Woman (NaNoRenO March 2010)
Writer and director of Wedding Vows (finished 2009).
Creator of Lakeside Sunset (finished 2006).

User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#33 Post by Mihel » Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:36 am

[EDIT: D'oh! D'ouble post :x ]
Last edited by Mihel on Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#34 Post by Mihel » Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:45 am

Well, for a guy with OCD they're not that minor. I seem to have forgotten that this piece does not mix well with my standard mastering eq & reverb treatment for whatever reason, and that the version you have is a mangled attempt to undo the remastering damage I accidentally inflicted on the file (long story). See if the attached file is any better (if it's not, I don't know what to tell you - the next step up in realistic synths is $400, which I don't have lying around at the moment :P ).

Also, in the long run, it won't matter, since the way I see things, the Canon itself will only play during the menus, main, & game screens. All the other music will be pieces with more subdued string parts, more varied instruments, and probably on the whole a quieter feel anyway, since the music shouldn't interfere with the game.

And the vinyl idea was a flash of inspiration I had whilst playing around with my various VST filters (one of which, the creatively-named Vinyl, simulates vinyl records). I would only consider it if I could make it perfectly clear that it was a record, and I might even ditch the switching thing. Whatever. For now, I'll just write the music :P

Also, in terms of each chapter, I think that I'm still willing and able to come up with the 14 different pieces. This isn't like Foxtaile, where I have to come up with new ideas for each piece, I have an already-written piece with a lot of melodic material to base my work on.

OTOH, you are the "revolutionary" 'round these here parts. Conventionally, games use pieces of music that are customized to each mood or event. However, your suggestion of a playlist intrigues me. It would be almost like putting on a CD (or turning on the iPod, or putting on a record :) ) and paging through an old photobook - gazing back at the memories not necessarily in order or anything while the music plays in the background.

As you are the director, it's your call. I'm going to start writing down themes this weekend as I move back into college whatever you end up wanting :P
Attachments
canon.txt
(Rename to .OGG to play)
(7.42 MiB) Downloaded 80 times
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
Nafai
Veteran
Posts: 290
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:10 pm
Projects: Elect: Ascendance
Location: Philippines
Contact:

#35 Post by Nafai » Sat Jan 20, 2007 12:33 pm

Finally had time to do a fairly in-depth review:
- Nice dedication
- [The first menu] Uhm… what the heck? Do I get to say the vow bit by bit? And out of order? Weird.
- [pick first choice] [cue flashback] Ah, I get it now…
- Some tense inconsistency I think. Shouldnt it be “Nerver in my wildest dreams HAD I expected…”
- Nice metaphors in describing the dress
- Very natural way of describing the awkward nervousness of protagonist
- [second choice] Ah – quite a time jump there.
- “trying to keep straight” seems a bit off – does this mean her expression? Her posture?
- Ends in quite the mysterious way…
- [third choice] Whoops, back again it seems. Maybe to shed some light on the previous comment at age 45?
- “pain in the eye” again, seems a bit off.
- Ah the things we do to get attention :D
- [fourth choice] Hm… Literal :P
- That was very sweet, the non-confrontation and silent understanding. Well done in showing the drama without melodrama.
- [Fifth choice] Oh, this is going to be bad…
- [Sixth choice] A bit bittersweet coming after the fifth. I’m tempted to finish off the seventh and just return to this one, but decide that it would be better to see it through.
- The capitalization of MY WIFE is a nice touch.
- [Seventh choice] Here we go
- Oh well done. That got to me. And nicely rounds this up full circle, as well as showing the importance of the vows serving as the menu choices. I wonder what the last choice holds?
- [Shift of POV] Oh – wow. So I’m only halfway through? That’s cool.
- [First choice] Wow, that’s early…
- Tushy? Nice to see an attempt at appropriate vocabulary from a 6 year old’s perspective
- [Second choice] Cute kid. Will look a bit strange next to drawn character art though, if ever you put that it.
- [Third choice] Hm, was confused for awhile since the timeline didn’t match the date of the end of the “make Lawrence jealous” plan. Was clarified when she referred to it in the past tense though.
- [Fourth choice] I like the line of giving the future to him, while he gave the present to her. Very nicely put.
- [Fifth choice] Kid Becky is a sweetie 
- [Sixth choice] Oh a shared birthday? Hm… might be nice if that was alluded to in another portion. Just adding to the symmetry of a very symmetrical work.
- [Seventh choice] This is a surprise – but it bookends the end of the Lawrence portion very well.
- Oooh, I’m in the credits :D
Wow... I have to say... it may be because of my current situation in life but that piece really spoke to me. Either you've been in love before dizzcity, or you're damn good writer - or both :P

Congratulations on this short but sweet (literally) work. I enjoyed it muchly ^_^

User avatar
dizzcity
Veteran
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:51 am
Projects: Lakeside Sunset, Wedding Vows, Working Woman
Location: Singapore
Contact:

#36 Post by dizzcity » Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:26 am

Mihel: Yeah, the new version does sound better. I think we'll go with that. Actually, your idea of a photo album gave me a whole new concept for the art style and direction for Wedding Vows, but I think it'll be too difficult to pull off successfully (and I don't think Choark is able to draw that many full-screen CGs), so we're going to stick to what's already there, mostly.

Well, I tried playing the game with the playlist effect. I still loved the Canon, but it jarred badly with some of the moods of the sections... especially with the sadder parts. So I guess we're going to have to go with the 14 set pieces. They don't have to be very long... I'm guessing about 1 minute, loopable, for each set piece.

I've just got a new idea for the music, but I'm not sure how feasible it is, so I'd thought I'd run it by you and check. You see, what I love about the Canon is the rising action and the way it builds up to a tremendous finale. I was thinking about how to use that to create a natural climax through music in the game. As far as I can tell, the Canon repeats the same melody about three to four times, but with additional layers and instruments. Is it possible to cut up that 7-minute-long piece into those discrete sections, and then program them to be played one after another during the main vows menu, after a certain number of sections have been read?

For example (cutting up the new canon.ogg by time):

Main menu & Intro sequence = 00:00 - 01:11
Vows menu music for reader having seen less than 3 segments = 01:12 - 01:50
Vows menu music for reader having seen 3-6 segments = 01:51 - 02:54
Vows menu music for reader having seen 7-9 segments = 02:55 - 04:12
Vows menu music for reader having seen 10-13 segments = 04:13 - 04:50
Vows menu music for reader having seen all 14 segments = 04:50 - 06:18
Ending music = 06:18 - 06:50

Something like that. I probably didn't get the right times for the phrases, but would that be possible? Or do you think that would bloat the game up too much?

-Dizzy-
A smart man follows the rules, a dumb man breaks them. A great man bends the rules and thus creates them.
Fanfiction.net Profile.
Writer and director of Working Woman (NaNoRenO March 2010)
Writer and director of Wedding Vows (finished 2009).
Creator of Lakeside Sunset (finished 2006).

User avatar
PyTom
Ren'Py Creator
Posts: 15422
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2004 10:58 am
Completed: Moonlight Walks
Projects: Ren'Py
IRC Nick: renpytom
Github: renpytom
itch: renpytom
Location: Kings Park, NY
Contact:

#37 Post by PyTom » Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:36 am

Ren'Py does let you cut music into parts, and then play it by giving a list of music filenames. So having n files of length m shouldn't bloat the game anymore than one file of length n * m.
Supporting creators since 2004
(When was the last time you backed up your game?)
"Do good work." - Virgil Ivan "Gus" Grissom
"Silly and fun things are important." - Elon Musk
Software > Drama • https://www.patreon.com/renpytom

User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#38 Post by Mihel » Thu Jan 25, 2007 1:25 pm

Yeah, it's not the bloating that has me worried. Or really coming up with a few small pieces.

I'm just slightly confused by what you mean by "cutting it up." Rather, I'm not exactly sure how you want them to be put back together :P Did you want them to be pieced together again with the rest of the segments, or played individually?

Also, I can program Ren'Py, so I can do my own programming if you need an extra load off your mind ;)
dizzcity wrote:Actually, your idea of a photo album gave me a whole new concept for the art style and direction for Wedding Vows, but I think it'll be too difficult to pull off successfully (and I don't think Choark is able to draw that many full-screen CGs), so we're going to stick to what's already there, mostly.
Perhaps for the First Anniversary edition? :P
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
dizzcity
Veteran
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:51 am
Projects: Lakeside Sunset, Wedding Vows, Working Woman
Location: Singapore
Contact:

#39 Post by dizzcity » Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:34 am

No, I'm not planning to piece them back together again. :) You see, what I want to give the player is the sense of progress through the story, from a slow start to a rising climax and an ending. I'm trying to achieve that through the Vows menu music, which will change as more segments are read. Since the Canon is made up of several similar-sounding movements/segments that are repeating the same melody with extra instruments and variations added on each time, I was thinking of using that idea. So, cut up the Canon according to the movements, so that we have a bunch of musical pieces about 30-120 seconds long that sound similar, but show increasing musical complexity. Then, program it such that whenever you encounter the Vows menu, one of those pieces are played. At the beginning, the simplest melody is played and looped, but as you read more and more segments, the game will automatically switch to another musical piece that has greater complexity, thus creating an artificial sense of "progress" and "climax" through the story.

But now that I think about it, that may be too complicated.

Maybe I'll just let the music from the previous vow section run on to the Vows menu as well, and keep playing until another section is selected. In other words:

Code: Select all

Main Menu, Intro sequence and first Vows menu -- > Full Canon
User picks Vow A and runs through Story Section A --> Music for Section A
User returns to the Vows Menu and browses through the list --> Music for Section A keeps playing
User selects Vow B --> Music switches to Music for Section B
User finishes Vow B's story and returns to Vows Menu --> Music for Section B keeps playing until User selects Vow C, etc.

That would probably be simpler, yeah. Let's go with that. So, aside from the Canon (which I already have), all I need is 14 more short 1-minute pieces for each section.

I think we're going to have to scrap the Valentine's Day deadline... it's too early, and I frankly don't have much time to devote to this project, so we probably have to postpone the release date until at least a month later... maybe White Day (March 14th)? Or just whenever.

-Dizzy-
A smart man follows the rules, a dumb man breaks them. A great man bends the rules and thus creates them.
Fanfiction.net Profile.
Writer and director of Working Woman (NaNoRenO March 2010)
Writer and director of Wedding Vows (finished 2009).
Creator of Lakeside Sunset (finished 2006).

User avatar
DaFool
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 4171
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 12:39 pm
Contact:

#40 Post by DaFool » Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:37 am

Guys you should talk to Alessio (if he doesn't mind), I've seen his code for Go! Magical Boy and seen how what you propose is executed.

If a song 3:30 can last 70 minutes without sounding repetitive, surely for a smaller piece such as wedding vows you don't really need that much music, you just need to give an illusion of complexity.

User avatar
Choark
Newbie
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:15 am
Location: England,liverpool
Contact:

#41 Post by Choark » Thu Feb 01, 2007 3:48 pm

Hello again everyone!

I'm posting to let everyone know I am still alive and in the project, drawing away. I haven't jumped ship or ran away or anything and have been getting in contact with Dizzcity when needed over PM. What he wants art side has (hopefully) been finalised and I have a very nicely detailed list so I'm going to get cracking in getting this done.

If you want to see some sketches of some scrapped designs, either because the person was the wrong age, some important detail or because I'm picky, well here they are below.

http://www.fantasydragon.net/choark/VN/
Sketch 001 and 005 are of our Blushing bride at a tender young age, unforantly a little too young in the end.
002 is actually of the Blushing Bride and 003 is her at an elder age.
004 is our Groom, though over worked and stressed.

Sorry for not having much else to say or to post.
~Choark

User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#42 Post by Mihel » Fri Feb 02, 2007 7:36 pm

Not to be outdone, I submit to the public the preliminary recording of the music for "I, Lawrence Summers, do take you, Rebecca Blythe, to be my lawfully-wedded wife..." as a sample of what I'm working on and to prove that I'm not just sitting on my ass :P

[EDIT: See below]
Last edited by Mihel on Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
dizzcity
Veteran
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:51 am
Projects: Lakeside Sunset, Wedding Vows, Working Woman
Location: Singapore
Contact:

#43 Post by dizzcity » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:10 am

Um... are you sure that's the right file, Mihel? It sounds more like music for Foxtaile to me (especially the beginning)... did you mix it up?

-Dizzy-
A smart man follows the rules, a dumb man breaks them. A great man bends the rules and thus creates them.
Fanfiction.net Profile.
Writer and director of Working Woman (NaNoRenO March 2010)
Writer and director of Wedding Vows (finished 2009).
Creator of Lakeside Sunset (finished 2006).

User avatar
Mihel
Regular
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:07 pm
Projects: Foxtaile, Dream Chasers, Wedding Vows
Location: NYC
Contact:

#44 Post by Mihel » Sat Feb 03, 2007 4:47 am

:oops: :oops: :oops:

Hmm. It does seem that I have accidentally written a variation on one of the Foxtaile themes into the first 30 seconds. #!(<&%@*$a;l;aowiencq

Craptastic. I knew it sounded familiar.

Alrighty. I need to get my brain out of "Asiatic" mode and rewrite a lot of stuff. How is the material after 0:31 (it's so hard to listen objectively to my own work...)? I know that the second part at least (the part in the major key) is nearly ripped off of the Canon (it's actually a fun guessing game to see if you can hear all the themes I've ripped out of there and mangled... but I digress).

I'm sorry. At least I didn't wait until the thing was released. :x :x :x

I'm off to become an hero...
Will you stay here for a while, dear, 'til the radio plays something familiar?

User avatar
dizzcity
Veteran
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:51 am
Projects: Lakeside Sunset, Wedding Vows, Working Woman
Location: Singapore
Contact:

#45 Post by dizzcity » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:44 am

I'm sorry for taking so long to reply... am perpetually overloaded with work (currently serving as game designer for an MMORTS, producer and game designer for another Turn-Based Strategy game, running the Student Game Development Group in my university, freelance writing for a game company, trying to learn Flash, and all this in addition to my regular workload of studies).

The second part sounds fine, Mihel. It's just the first part which is distinctly Asiatic. :) We can use the second half of the piece.

And Choark, your latest drawing is lovely. :) Becky is so shy in that picture!

I'm really glad that you guys are both going ahead with this so well and with so little direction from me. I appreciate it a lot, and please bear with me for my slowness.

-Dizzy-
A smart man follows the rules, a dumb man breaks them. A great man bends the rules and thus creates them.
Fanfiction.net Profile.
Writer and director of Working Woman (NaNoRenO March 2010)
Writer and director of Wedding Vows (finished 2009).
Creator of Lakeside Sunset (finished 2006).

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users