Magical Boutique II [MB1 spoilers!]

[Otaku Dash]

Oops, I forgot to talk about the mobility ^^;. Right now I can't say it will be in and I can imagine two possibilities : if moving the boutique around makes exploring new places easier, that's how it'll work. If upgrading your workers means of transport is easier, I'll take that instead.
Actually, the distance and movement problem is one I've ignored so far and it's a big one ô_o... Or is it? Hmm... *thinks*... Since things take place over a week at a time... I guess it's fair to say moving around is included in there... So... I could easily ignore distances for not-too-far places. It'd be the easiest for me and yet another micro management issue going away. As for the far-away places (I *will* have some desert in there dammit! XD), they would be unlocked through the story : you'd have quests that yield new means of transport when finished, which allows you to reach further places (if you know them). Again, since moving around would be implied during the week, nothing really changes in terms of gameplay... you just get access to new places.

And if we really *need* to deal with distances... it could just mean that far-away places are harder to work at as long as you don't have the appropriate transport. Thus, at first, work would progress very slowly... and if you get a chariot or better stuff, progress rate goes up proportionally to distance.
But really, I like the idea of ignoring distances now XD... I think it's a good thing for me to keep my mind off all these details.

It gives the player a way to solve (or not) pending problems with information/skills he gathered so far.. wich shows progression isn't "pushed", but "built in".

One thing I'm a bit scared of with the Round Table is that you'd get stuck. I don't want MB2 to feel like an adventure game that doesn't let you go on unless you talk to X or solve quest Y. I mean... obviously you won't befriend the dryads if you don't investigate them first... but it all flows naturally... Whereas needing to meet the bird girl to progress on the rat invasion quest... You have no way to know that ô_o... so you'll be stuck unless you're lucky and met her... or meet her soon enough. I don't really like how it removes control from the player :/...
(but at the same time, I'd really like further quests to reuse some other characters you know... so it's not *all* separated into unrelated chunks of story)

*takes Excaliblog from "Beat you to Death Angel Dokuro-Chan"*

I dearly hope you know how to cancel its effects too o_@;...

Thanks for your support ^_^

(oh and other people, don't be shy! The more opinions I get, the more thoughtful the result will be ^^)

*Hits Monele*

*SPRAAAALLLLGGHHHHH!!! (insert blood+Gore everywhere sound here)*

*does pose* PIPIRUPIRU PIPIRU PIPI!!!! (this is wierd considering I'm a guy XD).

NOW YOU KNOW WHAT WILL HAPPEN!!
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Jokes aside, we already talked about the chariot like system in contrast to the "moving-magbou"/"Base Motion mode <-> Base settlement mode". If You are having problems putting mobility in the magbou... then use the same sistem related to chariots (Uprgrade on horse power.. with horses XD Means less traveling time..etc.) However if you wish to dwelve on that I'll be happy to help find a solution.

As for the round table, you said it yourself didn't you? If you didn't find the brid woman you could make the poison for the rats. It means there is an option there... the player can choose the poison even if he finds the bird woman, but if he dosen't he always has the last resort. So lets think of ti as you said... each Chara as an Idea how to work it out.. so thinking ahead you could have variations for relating charas/Tech+Items in stock and dwelve on senarios.

I'll explain, let's pick the rat quest and work it on forking segments:


RAT PROBLEM ---> ROUND TABLE ---> SOLUTIONS:
- Frambroise related Solution;
- Pom related solution;
.....
- Neutral Solution;
- Bad solution; (It turns out your potion made the rats grow even more O.o);
- Refusal; (popularity may drop a little, but that's the only bad outcome).

Each solution pops up based on investigation and necessary key items as you mentioned right? However you could pull off a "Base" solution.. though ti won't reward you much OR Have good point in one characteristic but bad point on other (the example of guetting rid of ther ants but lowering your popularity with the poison). According with the chara you choose.. the outcomes will be diferent.. relating to them and improving Chara Interaction/confidence/plot events.

Ex: frambroise has the Idea of asking the Dryads what happened the previous days before the rats came it... with more investigation you could find a source and get rid of the rats withougth involving the Town (therefore since they didn't knwo you were in act they won't reward you in terms of monetary value); However your popularity might recieve a boost and the dryards friendship increase, helping you aquire more secrets from plants that might help you in the future.

At least this is the interpretation I got from your concep on the round table Monele. By creating base solutions the player won't get stuck, but will probabbly get him just a base ending. SO With harder work the player is rewarded in plot and relating quests.

[monele]

*Hits Monele*
*SPRAAAALLLLGGHHHHH!!! (insert blood+Gore everywhere sound here)*
*does pose* PIPIRUPIRU PIPIRU PIPI!!!! (this is wierd considering I'm a guy XD).

You actually did it ;o;... *headache*

For the moving system, I'm currently planning to be lazy and really not care about movements. There will be a few quests to enhance your transporation and their sole purpose is to unlock new places. Everything else is implied.

As for the round table, you said it yourself didn't you? If you didn't find the brid woman you could make the poison for the rats. It means there is an option there...

Mmm... But I think it was a lucky find for that one. I fear there won't *always* be a default solution that works.
This the kind of problem I wouldn't have if I wrote a linear story... I just thought "what could be done?" and "who could help with that?" and bam, it just made sense. But since it's a game, what makes sense in a particular situation suddenly blocks those without that requirement o_O...
Maybe it's not a real problem and I'll manage to find a way out of things, but right now I'm a bit scared it'll force me to *not* create links between stories and characters. Eh... the fight between independant quests and linear story ^^;

Let's see... looking at this from another angle that is "we don't *need* a Round Table *system*". It doesn't mean there wouldn't ever be Round Tables, but they would be smoothly included in the stories that need them instead. If you have a choice of action, either you get a regular VN choice (if it has to be made immediately), or you would immediately get unlocked activities based on the VN discussion (based on what you know @_@).
VN scene goes : ask the mayor about the rat problem, get details. if (knows BirdGirl) Pom suggests using a similar technique. if (knows Dryads) Framboise says they have problems with rats too and might know a solution. (no condition) Pimimi says we should just make a poison and get rid of them. Forest gets new activity "Ask Dryads about rats". Bird girl place gets new "ask about her bird caller"... and the Library and/or Boutique gets a "look into books for rat poison recipes".
I'm basically wondering if it's even necessary to give this a name like I did and make it a recurrent occurence *shrugs*.
The problem with having tests made only during a VN scene is that if you meet the dryads a few weeks later, Framboise should be able to bring her new knowledge to the table... and that's where I think it could be interesting to be able to discuss things again... The best way would probably be Framboise automatically telling you about the dryads+rats thing and suggesting it could help with the rat problem you're trying to deal with. Hmm... Maybe I could just test for such things and have additional events.

(therefore since they didn't knwo you were in act they won't reward you in terms of monetary value); However your popularity might recieve a boost

Why would one increase and not the other? . If they don't know, they won't think highly of you either I'd say ^.^


Hmm... let's try things with yet another angle. Let's say the game goes like this :
You do your stuff but don't meet Bird Girl nor the Dryads (or you decided to befriend the Thieves or something). Then you get to the rat quest (I just realized I managed to put the mandatory RPG rat quest in my game XD) and get a VN scene with your workers discussing the problem. The conclusion comes from Pimimi who suggests to kill them with fire, ahem, poison (since Pom and Framboise couldn't come up with their ideas). Therefore, you now have to deal with them with poison. That's it. Meeting the Bird Girl or the Dryads wouldn't change that fact. It'd be "too late". Obviously, this would have some consequences on the rest of the game since solving this quest in one of the "better" fashions could lead to other story paths.
So... does this sound good? Just okay?... or frustrating?

Note : I'll try to put topics in bold so it's easier to skim through posts ^^;...

[Otaku Dash]

(therefore since they didn't knwo you were in act they won't reward you in terms of monetary value); However your popularity might recieve a boost

Why would one increase and not the other? . If they don't know, they won't think highly of you either I'd say ^.^

Oops, I meant the popularity with teh dryards (therefore thef riendship thing ^^;).. sorry being at uni means I have to do a quick jolt of posting frenzy XD

Hmm... let's try things with yet another angle. Let's say the game goes like this :
You do your stuff but don't meet Bird Girl nor the Dryads (or you decided to befriend the Thieves or something). Then you get to the rat quest (I just realized I managed to put the mandatory RPG rat quest in my game XD) and get a VN scene with your workers discussing the problem. The conclusion comes from Pimimi who suggests to kill them with fire, ahem, poison (since Pom and Framboise couldn't come up with their ideas). Therefore, you now have to deal with them with poison. That's it. Meeting the Bird Girl or the Dryads wouldn't change that fact. It'd be "too late". Obviously, this would have some consequences on the rest of the game since solving this quest in one of the "better" fashions could lead to other story paths.

Yeah that's what I meant for plot ramification That way considering your actions, it could lead to new story arcs or diferent quests (relating or not to one chara). That not only changes the flow of a "Linear story" (as subquests relating to certain charas will hve diferent aproaches and quests) to "Replayability variant" wich means the player has to work harder to get better and diferent endings.

If you fear does overwhelm you though, there is always the point solution sistem.. ^^; Regarding what solution you came up, a counter variable can be added to control flow.. adding points regarding certain charas (ex: you follow Frambroises solution: +5 points). COnsidering then a base limit points between a base ending an dthe chara with most points.. you would get a quest/ending related to that chara. That has the problem, however.. of sounding too bland :S

I'm with your Idea of multi-quest branching.. however it's your call what to pick

[monele]

Sniff, sniff ;3;... I'm so tired today, and I wanted to work on MB2 but could only flop around the house and compile pictures for inspiration :/... I hope I'm not getting sick again >.<.....

mb2_persos : The characters I've drawn so far that I plan to have in MB2. That's a lot of ladies o_O;...

mb2_lieux : Not final, not geographically correct, etc... I just compiled many thumbnails of possible locations so I have a reference when I'm trying to think about what could happen in the game ^^;...

mb2_stories_blur : Same thing with thumbnails representing a particular story theme, but blurred as to not reveal too much. Sadly, most of these are really just a theme and have no content at all :/...

[Vatina]

I really like the look of the pointy-eared girl in the left corner
And the locations.... a lot of places, right from a flying city to a vulcano and a snow lake o_O Whoa.

I'm really looking forward to this

[monele]

I just realized the character picture was cropped ô_o... I reuploaded the correct version. So I suppose you were talking about the girl with elfy ears and long black bangs on the front hm? Glad you like her ^^

As for the locations, as I said, they're all theorical. There might be others replacing some of these if things work better that way... but they're really the kind of places I favor in games, so it's a "wishlist" ^_^.

[Otaku Dash]

*Jumps out of nowhere* VITAMIN C PUUUUUUNNNNNNCHHHHH!!!

*h-punch on monele*

*monele falls unconscious* There now go rest... it's all fine and dandy to think of your projects but you should tend to your body first!

*gives lemon mixed with honey on a pot* Now rest yourself.. FAREWELL!! *use blur with "WHOOSH!" Sfx* OTAKU MAN WAY!!!
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That aside, you should really try to rest.. your body and mind come first between projects and will to work.. nobody is asking an express train on magbou 2... just for you to try and check on it when you feel ok

On-topic: I'm with Vatina... the variation on locations sounds awesome.. and the characters portaits are really cute (I'm with Vatina on the long eared girl.. but then again I'm a RPG fan with a tend for the elves I guess *laughs*) All them show carisma and related traits on their faces. ^^

Anyways, take care of yourself and all that I've been ill for 5 weeks so I know how a pain in the..er.. neck, it is ^^; (then again my immune sistem sucks.. always has, always will).

[DaFool]

Hmmm... can you drop the desert and tropical locations? I hate it when RPGs do that. It's also probably just me since I live in the tropics for a good portion of my life. But I think sticking to Nordic-Snow or Mediterranean-Waters will keep the fairy tale feel. The cliffs are enough.

[Jake]

Hmmm... can you drop the desert and tropical locations? I hate it when RPGs do that. It's also probably just me since I live in the tropics for a good portion of my life.

...says the guy who put gas-burning lampposts in mediaeval Bavaria...


I must admit, though, I did look at those and think "Man, those can't be very near to the town from the first game, just how far is the player going to wander?

[rocket]

mb2_persos : The characters I've drawn so far that I plan to have in MB2. That's a lot of ladies o_O;...

We loves the ladies! (^_^) Yay!

I vote for tsundere Tinkerbell (upper left)!

Stay pumped!

[monele]

*h-punch on monele*
*monele falls unconscious* There now go rest... it's all fine and dandy to think of your projects but you should tend to your body first!

But... but! I'm sick of being sick! nyu! ;3;... And really, not being able to work on projects is making me depressed, so I'm really trying to find time and energy for them ^^;...

*gives lemon mixed with honey on a pot* Now rest yourself.. FAREWELL!! *use blur with "WHOOSH!" Sfx* OTAKU MAN WAY!!!

show moni disbelief with dissolve

"nobody is asking an express train on magbou 2..."
*I* am! :3... Well, no, I'm not in a hurry, but I do want to work on it. It's been going too slow for too long.

"(I'm with Vatina on the long eared girl.. but then again I'm a RPG fan with a tend for the elves I guess *laughs*)"
I hope she won't disappoint ^__^

"I've been ill for 5 weeks so I know how a pain in the..er.. neck, it is ^^;"
Oh boy... you know what I've been going through better than me then ^^;;... (it's only been 3 weeks I think)

"can you drop the desert and tropical locations? I hate it when RPGs do that."
Uhhh, no . I like my desert thank you (and it's not RPG ;p).
More seriously, I'm not 100% sure they'll be in the game, but I do like these types of locations and there are a few interesting things I have in mind for them in this world, so... we'll see.

"Man, those can't be very near to the town from the first game, just how far is the player going to wander?"
Indeed, these will be the exotic far-away places. They would probably not be *that* far in our modern world, but in MagBou, magic means will be necessary to get there in a timely fashion.

"We loves the ladies! (^_^) Yay!"
Yay ...
"I vote for tsundere Tinkerbell"
Haha, yeah! Give Pimimi some love ^.^.... she... err... won't give any back ^^;...


Good news : my apathy kinda lifted in the late afternoon and I picked up the WIP of MB2, commented the dreadful map out, and added some simple Scene Selector (it's just menus) so I could try and write a VN scene.

... I ended up writing 3 scenes. A scene being what you get when completing one of the quotas and I'd say they last from 1 minute to 4 minutes. And boy is it fun to write ... I've made myself a bunch of placeholder "faces" with only stylized expressions on them and I keep adding to them whenever I think up another possible expression that is needed and can't be replaced by an existing one (I'm at 50 different expressions shared by all the characters ^^;...). The good thing is that it's very easy to "compose" a set of faces for a new character and have a good idea of what a scene will look like in-game (compared to a single placeholder expression for each character).
For now, I'm using the "floating faces" you've seen in some of the video examples, coupled with the subtitle-style text. I hope it'll allow me to have more "animations" during scenes. Not real animations, but moving the frames around to simulate movements. For example, someone moving forward, or away... nodding, jumping, protecting someone else. It should all be doable by moving frames around the screen. I hope that and the various expressions will help bring life to the whole thing ^^.

Whoo~... I hope this motivation will stay ^__^.

[musical74]

*Votes for all three gals on the left side and the second from the bottom for *best pics**

Left side: Pimimi has a *mess with me and pay the price* look..like that! (Wonders if there is anything that she LIKES...) The gal below her...I like the *bangs are a different color* - not to mention the ears! She has kind of a *haunting look* too... that's good stuff! I'd ask her for a date... And the gal at the bottom? I just like her look =) She looks very relaxed and yet confident

Right side: The gal on top is cute, and I think the flower in her hair is really cute as well Reminds me of a *bubbly personality* friend I used to know (If you call her Lisa I'm gonna think you saw her in action LOL) The second one down? Eh...nothing wrong with it just don't *get* anything out of it like I do the others. I do like the hairstyle thought! The gal below that? Gotta be the ears! Meeeeeoooow maybe The bottom of the right side is cropped :S so I can't give an adequate look...but she LOOKS like she's laughing =)

So long as you continue to make progress and not give it up I won't complain Think Dash is doing a good job, er, keeping ya on track so there's no reason for me to as well, except to say this...

MUST....PLAY....THIS....GAME

[Otaku Dash]

*h-punch on monele*
*monele falls unconscious* There now go rest... it's all fine and dandy to think of your projects but you should tend to your body first!

But... but! I'm sick of being sick! nyu! ;3;... And really, not being able to work on projects is making me depressed, so I'm really trying to find time and energy for them ^^;...

Yeah I know what you mean.. considering I get really grumpy when I'm ill... god save the girl that falls in love with me *laughs* (but sincerely hopes this anomaly in the world comes true XD ). Anyways.. cheering for ya as always ^^

*gives lemon mixed with honey on a pot* Now rest yourself.. FAREWELL!! *use blur with "WHOOSH!" Sfx* OTAKU MAN WAY!!!

show moni disbelief with dissolve

*Stands on top of a building, Viewtidull joe like while a background song appears* My job is done... menacing Ills and flu's beware!! MY VITAMIN C PUNCH CANNOT BE STOPPED!! (*has a sudden urge to draw up his "Hentai man" for some wierd reason XD maybe I'll post something soon on the art corner *)

"nobody is asking an express train on magbou 2..."
*I* am! :3... Well, no, I'm not in a hurry, but I do want to work on it. It's been going too slow for too long.

Yeah Kinda... well ya know more than anything I want to see this come up ME IS EAGERLY WAITING FOR MAGBOU II! I just mean it as in not to strain yourself if you feel you are pushing the limitis tis all ^^

"(I'm with Vatina on the long eared girl.. but then again I'm a RPG fan with a tend for the elves I guess *laughs*)"
I hope she won't disappoint ^__^

Well she certainly is pretty.. then again all the female charas are ^^ I always liked your style.. so that's just one of the reasons I'm waiting impatiently for this project to finish ^^;

"I've been ill for 5 weeks so I know how a pain in the..er.. neck, it is ^^;"
Oh boy... you know what I've been going through better than me then ^^;;... (it's only been 3 weeks I think)

Well considering my life it isn't so bad.. still from the looks of it I was nearing what i call "a bed chaining flu" :S Worse was having to endure 3 hours and a half of Matematics even being Ill 3 weeks ago ^^;

"So using the derivate here we can.. *sounds of blowing nose echoing on the room*.... then we divide X squared to .. *snorting sounds*"

Yeah.. Not pretty XD

Whoo~... I hope this motivation will stay ^__^.

Likewise... GET YERSELF IN GEAR!! *holds excaliblog in hand*

P.S: Deserts and other magical places for the win.. nuff said. Who needs jets when you've got magic!

[monele]

"*Votes for all three gals on the left side and the second from the bottom for *best pics**"

Anyone but the regular girls eh? (elf, catgirl and fairy at least XD)

"Wonders if there is anything that she LIKES..."

We wonder too . The answer in MagBou. Same Magtime, same Magchannel!

"If you call her Lisa I'm gonna think you saw her in action LOL"

Ahah, it's Lily... not too far . But I have an important Lisa in my life, so the name might pop up at some point o_O

"Think Dash is doing a good job, er, keeping ya on track so there's no reason for me to as well"

Fair enough ^^. If the silence means "everything's fine, keep it up", I don't mind you guys to be quiet (though a little 'hey' from time to time doesn't hurt ^^)

considering I get really grumpy when I'm ill...

I get grumpy when I'm tired... and I'm tired all the time >.>...

I just mean it as in not to strain yourself if you feel you are pushing the limitis tis all ^^

I know, I know ^^. But the main problem has been me not sleeping enough, hence being tired and grumpy and negative about projects, hence not progressing on them. Progressing on projects has been the rare occurence. I can't describe how thrilled I was this Sunday after writing these three scenes. I just love doing that! And I definitely want to keep this up ^^

Well she certainly is pretty.. then again all the female charas are ^^ I always liked your style..

Aww, that's nice to say ^__^. I'll try to make a good job for their personalities too then ^.^

Worse was having to endure 3 hours and a half of Matematics even being Ill 3 weeks ago ^^;

Gah... I have bad memories of having to go through lessons while being sick, yeah ... (well, I did go to work all these past weeks but... it's not really the same)


=== Task interface ===

An attempt at what the task interface might be. Since it'll be a weekly occurence, I want it to be easy to navigate, but I'd also like to give it a more "arcade" feel, with the graphics.

#1 : You'd click on one of the characters on your team (first icon row). The icon would light up (all others are grayed out) and a full body picture of the character would appear on the left (similar to the resolve phase of MB1). A new row of icons will also appear : locations.
#2 : You can now click on one of the available locations which will light up (others grayed out) and be displayed as the background, fullscreen. A box appears with available tasks at this particular location with this particular character at this time, etc, etc...
#3 : Not shown on the screenshot : there will probably be a progress bar for each task (the quota filling).
You now get to choose one of the tasks for your character to focus on during the week.

You now go back to #1 to assign tasks to everyone. Once everyone has a task, you'd click on the famous "end turn" button (not shown on the screenshot).

Why I think this interface would be better than MB1 : instead of going down character > task > ??, and then having to go back up with some "Back" button, here you can instantly switch to another character, right after choosing a task for another. You can also instantly switch to another location... no need to "unselect" a previously assigned task.
But more than that, I'll try to have a hover action on the icons. This means that without even clicking, you'll be able to see what each characters is set to do during the next turn. Just hover on Framb's icon and you see her appear in full body with a forest background and "Investigate shadows" selected among the possible tasks. Hover on Dalma's icon and you see his full body pic appear in front of the boutique's background, with "Search the library" selected. Pom would be in front of the Lake, with "Fishing" selected.
There, in a second or two, you could get an idea of what everyone is about to do. Sure, it requires moving the mouse around instead of reading text under each character's icon (MB1), but I hope the very graphic way of showing the information will make it worth it.

I'll have to test it out, of course... and I'd like to hear opinions about this.

Note : if I ever have stats to show about the characters or locations, I'll have a button appear when you select a character/location and it'll show a popup window with information when clicked on.

[Otaku Dash]

Mmmm... it certainly seems an interesting idea to try out.. one problem though: Considering the places you showed and the number of player charas... wouldn't the screen get a bit overburnden? I mena it's easy to fix, but just wanted to point this out ^^;

Otherwise.. it seems very interesting. One question: is this supposed to change the map sistem you stated previously?