Wood Witch

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monele
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Wood Witch

#1 Post by monele »

Disclaimer : This is not a full blown project yet. It's more of an attempt at something and a little "does anyone care for this?". By creating this thread, I'm not making any promises, because I know how these go ^^;... So... I just hope you enjoy what's there.


This thread is, of course, linked to "If you were a witch..." in the General section. Here's one possible application of that whole thing, in a very bare form for now. Go grab the files attached to the post if you want to play with it. What follows are explanations on how it (will) works.

You're a witch living in the woods, near a lake and, for now, you have no particular obligation. You start in your cabin (I'm telling you because it's not written anywhere >.>...) where you can "Edit your witch" to make your very own little witch. It's all about stats for now.

++++ Attributes and their uses
* Body : Chopping wood, climbing, catching something, crafting, carrying heavy stuff, fatigue.
* Brains : Gathering, healing, brewing, cooking, learning/studying
* Spirit : Magic, spotting/searching, tests of will
* Charisma : tame animals, persuade/bluff/intimidate people, get good prices

You have 8 points to distribute among these. 5 is an average value, 10 would be quite exceptional and 1 would suck badly. For this "demo", charisma won't be of any use.

Then, you can click on "Skills".

+++ Witch skills
* Search : used to look for things and spot them. Ingredients and animals for example.
* Gather : used to gather ingredients (plants, ore, eggs, ...)
* Craft : used to create trinkets from various items. Necklaces, rings, amulets, ...
* Heal : used to heal wounds and sicknesses, wether through science or magic.
* Brew : used to make potions out of ingredients
* Cook : used to turn ingredients into delicious meals (your mileage may vary)
* Plants : your knowledge about plants. Useful to search and gather them.
* Animals : your knowledge of animals. Useful to spot, hunt them or heal them.
* Ores : your knowledge about ores. Useful to search and mine them
* Humans : your knowledge of humans. Useful in social exchanges and to heal them.
* Enchant : used to learn and cast enchanting spells (call rain, boil water, strong body, ...)
* Summon : used to summon spirits to help you, or to banish trickster spirits.
* Divine : used to divine the past, the present and the future. What's the weather tomorrow?
* Persuade : your simple presence could be enough to make people help you. A smile goes a long way.
* Bluff : how good are you at pretending and telling lies? You just say what people want to hear.
* Intimidate : heard about that witch who eats raw human brains for dessert? Better not bother her.
* Empathy : how much can you feel the true motives of people? Do people naturally trust you?

20 points to distribute among skills.
Only a very few are implemented right now : Search, Gather, Plants. This is to spur the imagination :).

A starting witch should probably focus on a few of these with scores of 3 or 4 (which could be seen as a natural talent in a domain). This is really where you define what your witch is good at and will determine her type. A witch with high Body, a good knowledge of Animals and Intimidate could be a huntress, protecting the forest, keeping an eye on the balance of all species. A witch with high Brains, points into Enchant, Summon and Divine and Craft could be an intellectual witch, enchanting artifacts for her living. Another witch with good Brains and Spirit, as well as knowledge about plants and ores and a knack for brewing could make a fine alchemist. With some Persuade and Bluff and some Charisma to help, she could even make quite some gold by selling potions at decent prices.

Of course, for now, it's all about being a gatherer, so go with Search, Gather and Plants. Or don't, and see how hard it might be to gather when your witch was not cut for it :)

+++ The current demo

Once you're done creating your witch (you can still edit her by going to her cabin, for testing purpose), click OK till you're back at the cabin. Then Go Outside. Gather Ingredients, and pick one of the list.

+++ How gathering works
It has two phases. First, you must actually find the ingredient. Some ingredients might be all over the place or at least very easy to spot (bright colors). Others might be under other plants, high up in the trees, or simply naturally camouflaged by having common colors.
The game makes a simulated dice roll (20 sided die or 'd20') and adds various bonuses. If it's equal of higher than a set difficulty rating, you found the ingredient.
When searching for plants, it's your Search skill + Plants skill + Spirit bonus. Spirit is an attribute and an attribute bonus is simply the difference with the average value, 5. If you have a Spirit of 6, your Spirit bonus is +1. If your Spirit is 3, your Spirit bonus is -2 (which makes it a malus).

Example : Melane is a bright young girl with more wisdom and senses than is usual for her age. She has a Spirit of 8, which makes a bonus of +3. She has learned a lot about plants and how to brew them into potions from her own mother.
She has Plants(4), Brew(3), Search(3), Gather(4) (and a few other skills...).
Melane is looking for clovers to make a Fox's Wit potion that will help her understand a complex magic book she has been reading lately. Clovers are quite common in this forest, going with a Search difficulty rating of 10.
Melane rolls a 7. We add Search, Plants and Spirit bonus : 3 + 4 + 3 = 10. 7+10 = 17. This is over the difficulty rating of 10, which means Melane quickly found a patch of clovers near a large tree.

Now to actually gather these. They're really not difficult to pick up but there's a trick to avoiding them drying too fast. Anyway, this is represent by a Gather difficulty rating of 10 (yes, same value as searching). Ratings of 10 represent something quite easy to pick up for someone who knows the essential of his job. Someone who has no particular knowledge nor natural abilities for this will still have a 50% chance of getting it right.

Gather roll : d20 + Gather + Plants + Brains bonus.
We're testing the Brains attribute here, so let's say Melane has 5 points, giving no particular bonus. Melane might be wise and alert, she is not dumb nor clever. An average girl in that regard.
Melane rolls a 5. 5 + 4 + 4 + 0 = 13. This is still enough to gather clovers, in spite of a bad roll and no natural abilities. Melane can thank her training and knowledge for this.

There! Melane has gathered 1 unit of clover, and it goes in her Inventory.

Now, you can compare what happened to Melane to what happens to you in the demo. You'll get the detail of the rolls and bonuses each time to try to gather an ingredient. You'll also hear a sound that lets you know if it worked or not. Looking at the bright blue panel, you'll be able to know what happened : did you even find the ingredient? Did you fail at gathering it? Or did everything go well?

+++ Inventory
The "Ingredients" button on the top left of the screen allows you to see how much of each ingredient you've gathered. Sadly, you won't be able to use them in the demo. But in theory, you could use these for brewing or cooking, or maybe even as spell components... unless you decided to sell them (they may also be useful for healing).

+++ Fatigue
In the upper right corner, you'll also see your Fatigue points / Maximum. This is a way to represent the efforts spent and the passing of time. Searching costs 1 fatigue, Gathering another 1 point. If you fail to find an ingredient, only 1 point is consumed, since you only Searched, not Gathered.

When the maximum is reached (which is 25 + Body bonus x 2), it turns red to indicate you should go to bed.
NOTE : I messed up in the demo, the max fatigue is only 25+Body bonus :/
Also, in theory but not in the demo, going over that limit will hinder your skills. Going over the limit will also shift to the next day : you only recover your max fatigue by sleeping, so sleeping after going over means you'll start the next day with extra fatigue.

Example : Melane has average Body, no bonus, so her limit is 25. On the first day, she goes to sleep at 22 fatigue points. She recovers fully, starting the second day with 0 fatigue, ready for a full day. But this time, she goes to sleep at 28 fatigue. After sleeping, she starts with 3 fatigue.
The more days you spend going over the limit, the more likely you are to get sick.

(again, this is *not* in the demo. The fatigue meter is just there to see how it *would* work).


+++ Conclusion

Well, I think that's it. I'll edit the post if I've missed anything ^^;...

I'm approaching this with tabletop RPGs in mind (hence the dice rolls) because it forces me to make a simple (eh ^^;...) system, which means it should be easier to code and balance. Players actually won't need to know any of this to play as everything will be done under the hood (you won't see the details of the rolls, just flavor text saying if it worked or not). If players *are* interested, though, if only to distribute points efficiently, it's possible there'll be an option to show the rolls.

So... I'd like to know if this looks like something people would play and if there are any comments about the skills and such. It's all *very* in progress, skills might be added/removed/merged, formulas could change, etc...
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Last edited by monele on Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Samu-kun
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Re: Wood Witch

#2 Post by Samu-kun »

Ooo... A new project? *ish intrigued*

*downloads*

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Re: Wood Witch

#3 Post by yummy »

But!
Where's Moni-tan? (The special cat familiar that says "monyan"!) XD

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Re: Wood Witch

#4 Post by Samu-kun »

Well, there's not much there yet, but this definately looks interesting. What would be really awesome is if you can also customize your witch's appearance as well as her stats. And how about an alignment system where you can pick a good/neutral/evil witch? :3

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Re: Wood Witch

#5 Post by N0UGHTS »

Oooh, alignment! Chaotic evil witch... :twisted:

Well, even without alignment, I'd still try to get the full version of this game, anyway. It's an interesting concept... Though it sure sounds like a lot to code and all.
Last edited by N0UGHTS on Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wood Witch

#6 Post by Mihel »

This has to be the most extensive use of the Dungeons and Dragons rules in a computer game since Neverwinter Nights! :P

But after having played Magical Boutique, how could I not be looking forward to this? I'd definitely play it, and I'm downloading the demo as I type.

Though, I can think of one problem already: no mention of swimming in the lake... ;)
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Re: Wood Witch

#7 Post by Dusty »

AWESOME!
Mihel wrote:This has to be the most extensive use of the Dungeons and Dragons rules in a computer game since Neverwinter Nights! :P
This sounds like a challenge to me. :twisted:

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Re: Wood Witch

#8 Post by monele »

Where's Moni-tan? (The special cat familiar that says "monyan"!) XD
Yeah... We thought of putting him in, but he proved to wreck the balance of the game, so he probably won't make it, sorry! (he kept spying on the witches as they bathed in the lake >~<)

Also, I love your avatar. Lah lah lah laaah~!
Well, there's not much there yet, but this definately looks interesting.
I know, I know :). I thought of going MagBou, posting a quick draft and going from there, posting updates as I go. I just need the immediate feedback ^^;...
What would be really awesome is if you can also customize your witch's appearance
Stats are clearly in. As for appearance, while I've thought about it, I quickly come to a problem : how visual should the game be? Basically, there are two possibilities :
- You can pick from multiple portraits AND if possible, colorize skin, hair eyes.
- You have a single witch graphic but you get small event piccies. Such as... bathing in the lake *cough* CHOOSE WISELY :3

There is a third option : choose a portrait but event piccies still show a generic witch.

In any case, I'm thinking of getting someone to do all the graphics this time. I'd rather focus on the coding as there'll be enough of it. If I am to do it alone, I'll only provide a single portrait and no events :/
And how about an alignment system where you can pick a good/neutral/evil witch? :3
Oooh, alignment! Chaotic evil witch...
I'm thinking of "no alignment". Because I don't want to be too close to D&D. Because alignments are complex to deal with. Because I really don't think I'll bring myself to put evil content (sorry, I just don't have what it takes...).
Thus, I'm thinking alignment will be abstracted and just represented through your actions. If you keep helping people and not asking for money, maybe you're good. If you keep lying and intimidating them to get what you want, maybe you're chaotic.
Though it sure sounds like a lot to code and all.
Yeah... Actually, it's not even too bad to code the mechanics. What I still really hate is doing the interface ~_~... Having to place hundreds of buttons and link actions to them and ensure you can't go over or under limits and all that... *that's* what annoying ^^;. It's no challenge, it's just tedious.
This has to be the most extensive use of the Dungeons and Dragons rules in a computer game since Neverwinter Nights!
Shh! No, no no, this is no D&D >.>... Sure, I use 20 sided dice and have attributes and skills, but I hope it doesn't mean I'm infringing on any copyright. I'm serious about this. I won't reuse spells, I won't reuse settings and the attributes and skills will be Witch specific, so I hope this can pass as "not D&D". Let's call it Woods & Witches :)

Now, though, I'd really like to get a system that *could* possible be reused, even in tabletop. But more realistically, I'd like something that can deal both with a Sim àla MagBou, and with more story-centric parts with unique skill tests. This would allow me to create mini adventures. Not sure yet if they would be a separate product or not.
Though, I can think of one problem already: no mention of swimming in the lake...
Give it time :p. There's no "dirty" meter yet anyway ;) (ooh I know you don't mind! :P)
AWESOME!
This is a global quoting : thanks for your early interest, I hope I'll be able to do something interesting and playable. And if not, I hope we'll have fun being creative on the topic while it lasts ^_^.

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Re: Wood Witch

#9 Post by musical74 »

Let's see here...we have a possible new VN in the making by the person who thought up Magical Boutique with a witch theme and a LOT of skills planned....

*Go monele! Go monele! Go monele!*

I like the way this is set up....I'm not familiar with table-style RPGs so it may take me a bit to figure it out.....but this is sounding good =)

I do have one question for ya: are you intending the witch to be *brand new*, i.e. has no skills yet? Based on what you said it sounded like it, but wanted to make sure :)
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Re: Wood Witch

#10 Post by Mihel »

Yeah, not much in the demo, but it's certainly enough to intrigue (and make me wanna play MagBou again :P )
monele wrote:Shh! No, no no, this is no D&D >.>... Sure, I use 20 sided dice and have attributes and skills, but I hope it doesn't mean I'm infringing on any copyright. I'm serious about this. I won't reuse spells, I won't reuse settings and the attributes and skills will be Witch specific, so I hope this can pass as "not D&D". Let's call it Woods & Witches :)
Of course. Wizards of the Coast can't copyright the idea of using dice and random numbers in games, since that idea predates them by a good few thousand years :P
monele wrote:Now, though, I'd really like to get a system that *could* possible be reused, even in tabletop. But more realistically, I'd like something that can deal both with a Sim àla MagBou, and with more story-centric parts with unique skill tests. This would allow me to create mini adventures. Not sure yet if they would be a separate product or not.
Hmm, tabletop MagBou... that sounds very interesting...
monele wrote:Give it time :p. There's no "dirty" meter yet anyway ;) (ooh I know you don't mind! :P)
I think very few of us would mind that meter :P
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Re: Wood Witch

#11 Post by monele »

and a LOT of skills planned....
T-t-t... see the attached file for "LOT of skills" :p. I don't think I'm going that far.
I like the way this is set up....I'm not familiar with table-style RPGs so it may take me a bit to figure it out.....but this is sounding good =)
I hope it won't be too much for the players. Thankfully, most of it will be behind-the-scenes anyway, but I suppose one will have to study the numbers a bit if they want to do exactly what they want. But I want to believe not understand the underlying system won't prevent one from making a good witch. Just go with instinct!
I do have one question for ya: are you intending the witch to be *brand new*, i.e. has no skills yet?
More yes than no. You will start the game by creating your witch, distributing points in attributes and skills. But given the initial pool, you won't be able to have brewing specialists right out of the bag. The maximum for skills should be 4 when you create her, so you can't really go crazy there. If you play with the demo, you'll notice the difference between having 0 and having 4, so this means your witch will not be totally "brand new", but there should be a loooot of room for improvement there. The idea is to start with an orientation, and then keep evolving through levels (yes, there'll be XP).

I also plan to have Feats-- errrr, I mean "Talents", such as "Brewing Specialist", which will allow you to create two potions out of the same ingredients needed for one and in the same span of time. In other words : doubles your brewing efficiency. Same thing to be expected for gathering and all the rest. For magic, it could be bonuses in each field (Enchant, Summon, Divine) or more specific things like unlocking better summons.
Still a rough idea, and it'd be nice if Talents would actually bring new possibilities to the table instead of just upping previous ones, but I'll need imagination ^^;
Of course. Wizards of the Coast can't copyright the idea of using dice and random numbers in games, since that idea predates them by a good few thousand years
My lawyer tells me to go with that :)
Hmm, tabletop MagBou... that sounds very interesting...
There, I've done it! Soon I'll have to make card games, books and an anime series. Wuh ;o;...
More seriously, were you thinking "board game" or actual roleplaying-game? I'm curious how people would see this work :)
I think very few of us would mind that meter
Aw, c'mon! Shame on you! :P. You'll have to wait for the expansion anyway... "Running naked, so what?"

EDIT : I actually forgot to put the illustrative image for the first quote ^^;
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That's lots of stats :)
That's lots of stats :)
Last edited by monele on Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wood Witch

#12 Post by Vatina »

This looks really exciting. I don't have a lot of useful crits or advice to give you (as usual), but just wanted you to know that I'm another one of those people who are really looking forward to this :)

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Re: Wood Witch

#13 Post by Showsni »

Of course. Wizards of the Coast can't copyright the idea of using dice and random numbers in games, since that idea predates them by a good few thousand years
They do have the patent on collectable card games, though; and, for example, tapping cards...

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Pars ... PN/5662332

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Re: Wood Witch

#14 Post by Mihel »

monele wrote:T-t-t... see the attached file for "LOT of skills" :p. I don't think I'm going that far.
I should hope not! Still, perhaps you should compress some of the very similar skills into more fundamental ones, just so that the newbie user (who isn't used to rolling up D&D v3 characters) isn't too confused. Like, Persuade, Bluff and Intimidate could all be rolled up into "Persuade," "Divine" and "Empathy" could probably go together, and it seemed a bit silly to me that I could find clover but then fail my gather check (since gathering clover involves plucking the darn thing out of the ground). But maybe I'm overthinking this.
monele wrote:I also plan to have Feats-- errrr, I mean "Talents"
Riiiiiiight ;)
monele wrote:There, I've done it! Soon I'll have to make card games, books and an anime series. Wuh ;o;...
I hope you realize that those prospects sound totally awesome, right?
monele wrote:More seriously, were you thinking "board game" or actual roleplaying-game? I'm curious how people would see this work :)
Well, since I'm in well tune with your d20-system influences, I was thinking of an actual pen & paper RPG. It doesn't look like it'd be that difficult to convert your underlying system over to actual dice, and it seems like the concept is open-ended enough to allow a DM GM to create small, isolated adventures as well as near-epic story arcs. Something would have to be done about the lack of other characters, though...
monele wrote:Aw, c'mon! Shame on you! :P. You'll have to wait for the expansion anyway... "Running naked, so what?"
Fine, be that way :P
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Re: Wood Witch

#15 Post by cloverfirefly »

I think this looks really promising! I played around a little with it. :) Are you playing as the witch girl or is this more of a raising sim?

A thought on making a "customizable" witch: You could possibly make it so that you can choose from a few witch archetypes, based on the attributes. For example, you could have a strong witch (for the body stat), a smart witch (for the brains stat), a spiritual witch (I couldn't think of anything better to call the witch based on the spirit stat), and a charming witch (for the charisma stat) or something like that. Each of the archetypes could have a different character graphic representing the witch (for a total of four character sprites).

This could be purely cosmetic and the only real "benefit" would be the ability to go through and collect all the different event CGs for the different girls. Or this could provide some stat bonus to the player, such as the strong witch gets a bonus to anything involving the body stat or optional side quests for the specific witch archetype. I think this would be more artistically possible than say, a 100% customizable witch with multiple hair styles, multiple skin colors,multiple outfits, and so forth.
studious_witch.jpg
Anyway, here's my take on what the smart/studious witch might look like. (It's a rough sketch, so please pardon any mistakes.)
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