Foxtaile: We're alive!

Ideas and games that are not yet publicly in production. This forum also contains the pre-2012 archives of the Works in Progress forum.
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monele
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#16 Post by monele » Sun Apr 02, 2006 10:55 am

Quick extra question : will character art be colored? :)

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#17 Post by rioka » Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:37 am

Yup! =)

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#18 Post by Taleweaver » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:20 pm

The current Foxtaile demo is more something of a "hell, you've waited long enough" demo than a realistic look at the final game. There will be MUCH more music, more paths, tons of additional character art, all new BG art, many new features to the engine - you name it. For me, it's the first time I've ever done anything that detailed, to Esperknight, it's the first truly serious test of his scripting skills, and I'm pretty sure Rio will also find something to brag about in Foxtaile ^_^ Our new musician, rabbi1337, originally meant to work at our still top-secret followup project to Foxtaile, might even contribute more music... ah, now I'm making you all excited, right? Well, there is no final release date yet; it mainly depends on how quickly we get the rest of the source material together. But I'm pretty confident we can make it until late summer.

More updates as soon as we have some ^_^
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#19 Post by PyTom » Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:54 pm

Okay, so after playing through the game once, I ported it over to Ren'Py so I could skip through it and get the rest of the endings.

I liked the historical context of the game, although it seems like it's a little off in some places. For example, Oda Nobunaga died in 1582, while the battle of Sekigahara took place in 1600... so it seems like it would be more than a few years ago, especially if Hideharu is fairly young.

I do like the idea of using Japanese history as context for the game, as it gives some texture to it. It's important, though, to get the details right.

Would it make sense for Hideharu to call Tokugawa "Ieyasu"? It seems somewhat informal to me, it would be like a German soldier calling Patton "George".

It would be nice to include some of the historical context in a README file, or as an extra.

I like the fact that the game gives reasonably diverse choices, although right now most of these choices are false branches, as there's basically only one path through the story, which is left and rejoined. That leads to jumps from hating humans to taking care of one... which can be a little abrupt. This may be an artifact of the control-flow only branching.

The look of the game could use some work. Black-on-white text clashes with the fairly dark backgrounds. I'd probably change it to white on dark, and increase the font size to make it easier to read. None of the dialogue boxes seem to need the small font size that's being used.

I'd guess the engine needs more work then Taleweaver estimates. Rather then 75% done, I'd say it's closer to 50%. (Assuming the demo engine is the latest version.)

The art (fore and background) and music are very nice, and all seem suitable for the game. I can't wait to see the colored art.

All in all, I'm looking forward to a final release of this project.
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#20 Post by monele » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:01 pm

It would be nice to include some of the historical context in a README file, or as an extra.
It would be even better if it's spilled out throughout the game. After all, the protagonist doesn't know much about the human world, so it's fair that it would be explained to her, hence the player too :)

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#21 Post by Taleweaver » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:56 pm

PyTom wrote: I liked the historical context of the game, although it seems like it's a little off in some places. For example, Oda Nobunaga died in 1582, while the battle of Sekigahara took place in 1600... so it seems like it would be more than a few years ago, especially if Hideharu is fairly young.
You're probably right about that; it's a bad choice of words. I'll probably change that for the final release. As a matter of fact, one of my early scene layouts featured the idea that Hideharu was born on the day Nobunaga commited seppuku, but I couldn't find a good place for that scene :)
Would it make sense for Hideharu to call Tokugawa "Ieyasu"? It seems somewhat informal to me, it would be like a German soldier calling Patton "George".
I beg to differ, knowing that even during his time as Shôgun, Oda Nobunaga was referred to by his given name. Also, I'm already taking many liberties with the Japanese honorifics. While they'd probably be a necessity in a true Japanese language release, I think they distract from the story if the language doesn't already convey the idea. Also, there was only one Patton of any military interest, but more than one Tokugawa :)
It would be nice to include some of the historical context in a README file, or as an extra.
Bonus section. 'nuff said.
I like the fact that the game gives reasonably diverse choices, although right now most of these choices are false branches, as there's basically only one path through the story, which is left and rejoined. That leads to jumps from hating humans to taking care of one... which can be a little abrupt. This may be an artifact of the control-flow only branching.
These choices are not really false branches but point-value branches. The things they influence, however, are not in the demo. Wait for the full game.
The look of the game could use some work. Black-on-white text clashes with the fairly dark backgrounds. I'd probably change it to white on dark, and increase the font size to make it easier to read. None of the dialogue boxes seem to need the small font size that's being used.
Agreed, wholeheartedly. I wasn't really satisfied with it myself but wanted to spare EsperKnight the additional stress of working on the visual aspects before the demo release. Expect this to be changed.
I'd guess the engine needs more work then Taleweaver estimates. Rather then 75% done, I'd say it's closer to 50%. (Assuming the demo engine is the latest version.)
Hey, at least it works without crashing now, eh? ^_^ You have no idea how much work we all put into this before it finally ran bug-free. On the other hand, you probably DO have a pretty good idea of it, so forget my last sentence :P
The art (fore and background) and music are very nice, and all seem suitable for the game. I can't wait to see the colored art.
All in all, I'm looking forward to a final release of this project.
Why, thanks from us all :) We're giving our best!
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#22 Post by PyTom » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:15 pm

Taleweaver wrote: I beg to differ, knowing that even during his time as Shôgun, Oda Nobunaga was referred to by his given name. Also, I'm already taking many liberties with the Japanese honorifics. While they'd probably be a necessity in a true Japanese language release, I think they distract from the story if the language doesn't already convey the idea. Also, there was only one Patton of any military interest, but more than one Tokugawa :)
I didn't know that about Oda, so if they called the shoguns by their personal names, so be it. I concur with the lack of honorifics... they often seem a bit forced in western releases. I should point out that your paragraph above is a bit anachronistic... sure, there were multiple Tokugawas, but not at the time of the game.

Doesn't matter, I guess... It just seemed a bit casual to me.

These choices are not really false branches but point-value branches. The things they influence, however, are not in the demo. Wait for the full game.
It struck me, though, that the join may be a bit abrupt. If scene n is branched, you might want to have 2 variants of scene n + 1, to even out the join slowly. (So if you start off saying humans are filthy, and then in scene n have to deal with them, scene n + 1 shows you overcoming your disgust, or something like that.)
Hey, at least it works without crashing now, eh? ^_^ You have no idea how much work we all put into this before it finally ran bug-free. On the other hand, you probably DO have a pretty good idea of it, so forget my last sentence :P
Yeah... and I also know it's hard to estimate how long things will take. Sometimes simple features take longer then one would think. Loading/Saving is simple, but the UI for it requires a file picker, and probably a yes/no dialog to confirm slot overwrite.

All I'm saying is that the last 20% of the features usually take 80% of the time. But it is nice to see a running game, that doesn't crash.

One other issue: I would suppress the screen redraw after a CHAR= or BG= tag. As it is now, the screen blinks (that is, the text box is removed and then redrawn) each time the character changes, which is a little distracting.

(Should be an easy fix.)
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#23 Post by Taleweaver » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:27 pm

PyTom wrote:sure, there were multiple Tokugawas, but not at the time of the game.
I'm talking about Ieyasu's two sons, especially his younger son Hidetada. By the age of 21 (i.e. in 1600), he was already known as a skilled warrior and served at the rank of chui, or lieutenant, in the army of the Tokugawa. He must have also been rather skilled at political matters as he succeeded Ieyasu as Shogun later :)
It struck me, though, that the join may be a bit abrupt. If scene n is branched, you might want to have 2 variants of scene n + 1, to even out the join slowly. (So if you start off saying humans are filthy, and then in scene n have to deal with them, scene n + 1 shows you overcoming your disgust, or something like that.)
Good point. I'll probably expand the scene a little more.
One other issue: I would suppress the screen redraw after a CHAR= or BG= tag. As it is now, the screen blinks (that is, the text box is removed and then redrawn) each time the character changes, which is a little distracting.
(Should be an easy fix.)
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#24 Post by esperknight » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:28 pm

I have to agree on those last features like save/load. The good thing is, I had coded it once before, before my hard drive crashed and lost my code (learned a hard lesson there) so I got that pretty much ready to go, but the rest will take a bit of doing. Truthfully as far goes the text and everything, I don't think that text frame will be the final one used, just using it for right now since I suck at designing such things :) Also, I know about the flashing (although I don't notice it to much now ;) and that will dissapear since I'm gonna recode the graphic loading and text displaying schemes. Overall really this project was just to help me learn C++ programming and boy has it definitely helped :) Also, for text skipping if anyone wants to do it, LCTRL and RCTRL both skip text :) I appreciate all the comments about the engine! Thanks!

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#25 Post by mikey » Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:30 pm

Well, Foxtaile so far has been all about story, things happening and the way I saw it, this was basically a build up for the real thing, so I'll be waiting for the final release to enjoy what will be beneath the surface. Because of the emphasis on the story in the demo it's hard to undestand or find the main ideas and emotions the game will deal with (this is what matters to me as a player), it's hard to even say whether it will be ren'ai or not. But I'm sure there will be something, so I'm looking forward to the "spirit" of this game once it's finished.

For all I care the interface can be as clumsy as you want, and the plot can have gaping holes and historical inconsistencies ^_^, I'm not the type to be bothered about that. But if you want something that hasn't been said, I noticed that even when there was no character talking, there was an empty name box (the little one on top of the main textbox), maybe it should be hidden when empty.

Graphically, I really like it when there's an effort to NOT use filtered photographs, so keep that up, it's always nice. And I've fallen in love with eclipse's graphics :) Even a fox is attractive (yes, I know it's male).

In terms of music, it's fitting, even though I'm not entirely certain whether it has to have such a strong Japanese accent. Maybe this is my only true comment on the style - as someone who isn't incredibly interested in historical backgrounds, it feels a bit like an overkill or too much emphasis on the Japanese aspect. As a player I'd prefer something more easily digestible, but it's a matter of how you'll choose to focus the game in the end - the more specific, the more intensive for the ones who are into its background and the less attractive for those who aren't into those things.

As a designer however, in this tradeoff thing I usually aim against the general appeal, so the most important thing is that it's good for the game and whatever will befit its nature the best.

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#26 Post by Taleweaver » Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:00 am

We have something new for you: Foxtaile talks.

...okay, it's only the intro which is spoken, but it's nifty enough for me to mention it here. And once you see it in combination with the intro sequence Rio has created for us, you'll love it. I already do.
Attachments
IntroMixed.rar
The intro music
(3.49 MiB) Downloaded 105 times
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#27 Post by monele » Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:59 am

AWE... SOME... I love the voice (thank god for good voice acting >o<) and the music is almost epic... very movie like. Yea, I actually imagined a movie kind of intro while listening to this ô_o... Aaah, now I wanna see this in-game @_@

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#28 Post by Watercolorheart » Sun Jun 25, 2006 9:20 am

I think I'll wait until it's released. I see, with a lot of projects, a lot of hopeful things but not always enough motivation to see them all through. Going by your signature, though, it says the script is at 100% or is that for a different game? If the writing is complete, everything else is just extra work.

I'm doing a longish game right now. Writing is difficult, especially detailed, but if a little bit is done each day, it gets a little easier. I think the hardest thing for me isn't finding the time but finding the "seed" of the idea for the next scene and running with it.

It's also a real challenge to write seperate but entertaining branches for the different paths since I want them all to be a little different.

Have you been running into that problem? Like, there's a path A and a Path B and they meet back in the middle for the main storyline, and some additional text only for one path or another? But, while writing it, you do one path, and then have to go back and do the whole rest of the other?

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#29 Post by Taleweaver » Sun Jun 25, 2006 10:56 am

BCS wrote:It's also a real challenge to write seperate but entertaining branches for the different paths since I want them all to be a little different.

Have you been running into that problem? Like, there's a path A and a Path B and they meet back in the middle for the main storyline, and some additional text only for one path or another? But, while writing it, you do one path, and then have to go back and do the whole rest of the other?
No, but that's because I usually work out the entire story backbone beforehand and only start writing the true scenes after I'm certain everything works out the way I need it to. Call me compulsive :)
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#30 Post by mikey » Sun Jun 25, 2006 12:41 pm

I can only compare this to Shira Oka, but it leaves a much better impression. Sorry, SO :(

Then again, as you said, it's not going to be voiced, while SO probably is. And it's hard to compare the projects anyway, so that was a bad example in the first place.

Alright, let's just ask the question that's on everyone's minds... who is behind the mystery voice? :wink:

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