Sad/bad endings?

[jack_norton]

What do you think of them? In my most recent games I made all "happy endings", but for a new game I'm thinking to start soon I was wondering if I should also include more "sad/bad" endings. The setting is fantasy, but not just "happy fantasy", something where there is both good and evil, and good and bad events happens.
Personally I found some bad/sad endings in games, movies, books interesting as much (if not more) than the "good" ones, so was just wondering what people think

[DaFool]

The games I'm working with Taleweaver have all bad/sad endings, and even the method to achieve those can be pretty sadistic. Then again, we aim to please ourselves since we're hardcore gamers (of Japanese games, at least).

If you decide to go that route don't hold back and be brutal with what happens to the characters. The game will appeal to the core Steam demographic (even if they decide as usual not to let your game on board) - that will probably skew more male and less casual.

It's hard to pinpoint exactly how to get that exact feel -- as an example, look at Cthulu Saves the World / Breath of Death VII compared to, say, the offerings of Adorlea Games. They're all 8/16-bit NES-era JRPGs but (besides the obvious price differential), there's this "edginess" (for lack of better term) that makes Zeboyd games 'hardcore' and the RPGMaker games 'casual'.

All the games and movies which I remember fondly, have been far from bright and sunny, and have contributed to my becoming a movie/game buff. So yeah, go for it.

[Rewritten Ennui]

There's already a topic like this in the Game Makers' Corner right here.

On topic though: I prefer a mix of sad and happy endings. Just don't go to one extreme where they sound unrealistic. Finding a middle ground is tough, but it's worth it if your target audience is pleased with the result.

[jack_norton]

Ah sorry didn't know about that other topic !
I think I'm going for a mix indeed: 2 good and 2 bad endings for each character. Being a fantasy story, I think "unrealistic" won't be too much of a problem

[Anima]

I absolutely hate bad endings, if I know in advance that a game has only bad endings, I will not play it.
My tolerance for bitter-sweet endings is actually quite a bit more pronounced. (Persona 3 was okay, for an example)
But good and happy endings are definitely better.

[Camille]

I think as long as it's balanced and there aren't more bad endings than good endings, it's okay. Sometimes the sad/bad endings can be really compelling and offer insights about the characters/stories and I mean, life itself isn't always happy. Often with otome games, there are extra CGs given with the sad endings, so most people will play through them at least for that.

[jack_norton]

I absolutely hate bad endings, if I know in advance that a game has only bad endings, I will not play it.
My tolerance for bitter-sweet endings is actually quite a bit more pronounced. (Persona 3 was okay, for an example)
But good and happy endings are definitely better.

Well I wouldn't play a game with ONLY bad endings either that was never my plan indeed.
Most people that played Bionic Heart were happy with the "happy endings" but the ones who impressed them more were the bad ones (

in particular the one where Tanya kills Helen out of jealousy is one of the most quoted, because it happens in such a way that shocked most players

).
Okay then, 50% good / 50% bad endings!

[yummy]

I think it's really up to you, on this point.
I personally don't like "bad" endings because there's a notion that it's not the "true" ending, so when I sense it goes that way, I tend to skip the scene and go back to the previous flag point.
So that means you've typed your text for nothing

But I understand people who like to compare stories to good old fairy tales where everything ends in happiness. Then they compare stories to reality and they aren't satisfied because they feel like they have been cheated (like the tale of Santa). But then again, the only important thing is not a story that looks "realistic" but rather "credible".

So if you want to create bad endings, go on, don't hesitate! It's your creation and you are the master of your creation. You don't really need external opinion, because there are so many people with so different taste.

[Dollywitch]

I'm a big soppy so I tend to prefer good endings. In general the idea is that these get overplayed, but with VNs etc. bad or at least bittersweet endings tend to get played out almost as much. The reason this becomes tiring more quickly is that we emotionally invest in characters and seeing everything predictably fall apart becomes aggravating. It's fine to explore those emotions, but a bad or bittersweet end isn't inherently better and there are reasons why having overall good ends are more preferable on average.

[Desu_Cake]

Bad endings beat the **** out of good endings!

Aside from being interesting in their own right, bad endings also tend to make the good endings feel better, since they let you know that it could have turned out badly.

[Dollywitch]

I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but if you're interested, read up on Cavia and Drakengard's endings. I don't know if I recommend you play the games themselves though, so if you don't mind being spoiled for one of the routes(which you'll probably know if you play a certain recent popular action rpg anyway):

After completing all the routes(which mostly result in the world ending in various ways), collecting all the weapons etc., an arduous task, you are treat to an ending where the main characters & extra boss dimension shift into our earth; and subsequently get shot down by the JDF. That's it. It's the "Fuck You" ending. An ending so bad, that it actually causes the shitty post apocalyptic setting Nier, a separate franchise, by means of a magical plague that wipes everyone out by turning their bodies to salt(or driving them insane, depends on whether or not they accept a pact with the Queen of the giant floating baby gods).

I actually love this because the endings, especially this one, are just so hilariously bad it takes the piss out of every cheap shot bad ending ever.

[TsukiShima]

They actually make the game interesting. Though some people won't like it, others will enjoy it, as it will be different and sometimes out expectation.

Though, I sometimes don't like if it's are all bad endings, or all good endings.

[papillon]

Some players only like to play once and are really angry/disappointed when that first ending they bang into is a bad one.

Luckily, I think these players are a minority, because I *like* my bad endings. I'm in line with the viewpoint that if you can't fail, it's not a game. Also, some of the most emotionally effective moments for me as a player have been in VNs where I *thought* I'd screwed up and was headed for a bad ending, only to discover to my huge surprise and relief that actually we weren't all dead after all.

[Auro-Cyanide]

I think a sad/bad ending can still be a good ending. Some of the best endings I have ever read were very sad (main hero dies etc) but they were very fulfilling and satisfying. I think as long as everything is where it should be, that the story is whole and the ending itself is interesting and makes sense, it's all good. I do think a combination of good and bad is nice unless you are making a specific point about something, say, there is no way possible for the story to have a 'good' ending and so you make the reader realise there is no way to escape. This might be good if you were creating a story about fate or something. Otherwise, balance is always a god approach.

[LVUER]

Well, 999 only have one good ending, the other 6 are BAAAAD (though it's better in technical term).

So if you want some bad endings, I think it's ok. Just don't make the good ending is too hard to get, or make sure player know what they're going to get.