Regarding realism

[gekiganwing]

Do you want realism in your VNs? If so, how much? (After all, there is a spectrum of realism in storytelling. It can range from "set in present-day, no magic or superpowers" to "hard science fiction" to "non fiction.") Specify specific types of stories and gameplay. Provide some context if possible.

I have been thinking about this topic lately. The vast majority of the video games in my collection have absurd stories, and take place in fantastical worlds. But the prose fiction that I've appreciated over the years ranges all over the genre map.

Right now, are you more interested in visual novels that present a plausible story, a fantasy, or somewhere in the middle? Do you want one that tries to entertain, tries to educate, or a little of both? How serious do you want the narrative and its presentation to be?

[Greeny]

I don't care how fantastical it is, as long as it's presented in a believable fashion.

[Obscura]

I prefer realism in my VNs, with scifi running a distant second. Fantasy is a mixed bag for me.

This probably has to do with the fact that I will always have a fondness and bias for realistic fiction. Even the best scifi or fantasy I've read has never been able to affect me in a way a short story would from an author like John Cheever or Denis Johnson. I've always looked for that sort of spiritual catharsis I get when reading this type of fiction in scifi or fantasy, and rarely do I ever get it.

My favorite movies are all comedies that take place in this modern world--Trainspotting, Office Space, Swingers, Barcelona, etc. etc.

The visual novel I would most like to play would be written like an indie comedy, with an emphasis on characterization and dialogue. The problem is people who write like this are most likely writing screenplays or actual books, and possibly comic books, not visual novels. I do see a couple of promising writers on these boards though...I'm really hoping they take VNs into new territory.

I'm pretty sure I'm an outlier though in terms of my tastes, which are the extreme end of the spectrum when compared to other gamers.

[nyaatrap]

"Real" and "Realistic what people feel" are different. I think artist's job is to offer the latter but not the former.
Basically, people would have "realistic feeling" on one step out of their conscience; not the plain real world they're living, but not too far from their morals and imaginations. It doesn't matter what is physically true or not. Only matter is what their minds feel. Sometimes physical reals impress people because they're outside of their mind. Sometimes fantasies bores people because they're inside of their mind.
This "one step out" is the key marketing point. It requires understanding of minds of target users. I just calculate it from my target users and just follow this result (adding my personal taste a bit... lol no, a lot ).

[TsukiShima]

Even in VN, or games, or even any stories, I prefer realism. That's why I enjoy the theme slice-of-life the most, or school-life, or college-life, or anything else equal to that more than the other genres.

This is because I feel that it's close to my heart, and my surroundings. I can know how the situation truly is, and how real that feeling can be. To me this is also why Clannad, School Days, Ano Hana and the others became a hit.

Though, sometimes fantasy can be apply as well. The role of VN is to make us imagine, dream and feel that life can be more interesting than its actually is. I have my seasons I guess, there are some times that I enjoy horror and sci-fic, but I never really enjoyed the concept of heaven and hell, angels and demons, magicians and elf, etc.

[dramspringfeald]

I like Full realism in all matters. Most people including OP think Full Realism means "No lasers" or "No Magic" and well that's not entirely true.

It's not a matter of "realistic" or not its a question of whither we can believe in it. Sure there is wiggle room for rule of cool, Ignoring one or 2 laws of physics to move the story along. But if you have a character hovering "A Wizard did it" Had better not be your answer...

If there is magic I want to know if it has feeling? does it give off a smell? Does it Make you smell? Does the Dragon have weight. just how 'human' is the god?
If there is Scifi I want to know at least the basics of your universe? Does the Space Ship have a Colder area, do the pipes rattle? Is it their first time in 0G? Why do they use swords or for that matter are guns even allowed on stations? How much does the ship weigh and can it stop fast enough.

I'll go into it more when I get up... it's getting early. Also Magic does have a smell. It's of Ozone and Spices.

[TrickWithAKnife]

For our game's main purpose, it will be set in real modern-day Tokyo, with enough changes to avoid potential legal issues.
The characters will be *fairly* realistic, so no serial killers, gangsters, robots, etc.
The characters' ways of speaking will be as realistic as humanly possible, particularly with the Japanese characters.
There may be some situations that push reality a little, but nothing major enough to make anyone say "this is impossible".

For playing games, the level of realism isn't really important, as long as it is consistent, and the behaviour of characters isn't too bizarre. For example, if a serial killer just killed the main character's family, having them suddenly fall in love would drive me nuts. It may sound stupid, but I've actually seen things on par with this occur in the very early stages of VNs. No matter what happens after that, I can't take the game or the creators seriously.

[Hijiri]

Do you want realism in your VNs? If so, how much? (After all, there is a spectrum of realism in storytelling. It can range from "set in present-day, no magic or superpowers" to "hard science fiction" to "non fiction.") Specify specific types of stories and gameplay. Provide some context if possible.

I have been thinking about this topic lately. The vast majority of the video games in my collection have absurd stories, and take place in fantastical worlds. But the prose fiction that I've appreciated over the years ranges all over the genre map.

Right now, are you more interested in visual novels that present a plausible story, a fantasy, or somewhere in the middle? Do you want one that tries to entertain, tries to educate, or a little of both? How serious do you want the narrative and its presentation to be?

I'm personally in the middle route. Realism is a good thing, but there are some levels that can only be reached with absurdity, and heavens that can only be pierced when we suspend disbelief.

Deadly Premonition is one of my favorite games, and it presents the characters in a realistic fashion. However, as we play the game, we come to think like York (Which sums up to "Common sense? What common sense?") and accept the fantastic situations that are presented.

[Desu_Cake]

Personally, I feel that more than realism or lack thereof, what matters to me is internal consistency. That the world the story takes place in follows it's own rules, regardless of how different they may be to the rules governing our own. A world that's almost reality, but inconsistent is harder to suspend disbelief in than a world that is really weird, but everything in it makes sense for what it is.

A good example of what I mean (and it both is and isn't consistent) is Harry potter. Specifically, it's stated god knows how many times during the series that no spell can bring the dead back to life. And that rule is upheld, technically, but there seems to be a huge number of spells, artefacts, and other stuff that seems to do so. The rule is never broken, but it is bent around the plot a good bit, and it kills that willing suspension of disbelief somewhat, for me at least.

Essentially, what I mean is, I like stories that are plausible given the rules governing them. What those rules are don't matter in the slightest.

[gekiganwing]

Thanks... I was expecting replies along the lines of "it depends on what you want / what you're creating." After all, even though there are many good things about realism, it's not always appropriate. There is a time to be indulgent, a time to hold back, a time to write stories, and a time to present real life. There is a season, turn, turn, turn.

One of the thoughts I had while creating this thread was "do people want a VN with a simple, believable story, and a cast of ordinary characters?" This vague concept could be fiction or an edutainment game. Either way, there's a risk that it might become so realistic that people find it dull or uncomfortably familiar.

[TrickWithAKnife]

I think that is a valid concern, and something I've been thinking about a lot too.
To be honest, most people's lives, while enjoyable to them, wouldn't make the greatest game. And when you try to add your own real experiences, some of them may sound unbelivable.

[Blane Doyle]

Why wouldn't anyone want realism in their stories, VN or not? It doesn't make sense half the time otherwise. I am going to focus on contextual realism here, since everyone else touched on basics. For example:

As much as I love The Avengers and as much as I know comics and derivatives of their stories are basically escapist entertainment (really, what fantasy isn't?), I expect contextual realism. If Hawkeye (an ordinary human who just has an extraordinary skill set mostly based around aim) could suddenly survive a drop from 10 stories up without explanation and without a scratch, while unconscious, I would call foul.

Because it doesn't make sense in context. Hawkeye isn't Captain America, he does not have super serum. He is not Thor, he is not a Norse God. He is not Iron Man, he has no suit to protect him. He's not the Hulk... no explanation needed. He's Hawkeye, the most ordinary of the entire team. I expect him to at least walk away with a dislocated shoulder, even if that is a bit implausible people have walked away from large falls with minor injuries before and I could buy it.

On the other hand, if Thor fell from the same building in the same context... I would be actually surprised if he was hurt at all. If he was hurt and no one wondered why the NORSE GOD OF THUNDER was injured from such a petty fall, I would wonder if everyone suddenly forgot who they were dealing with.

See. It's all in the context.

Without realism it borders on the absurd and unrealistic, even in fantastical settings. Absurd works are fun and all, but it is hard to take them seriously and if you have a more serious story you need that realism to keep people involved. I have dropped more than one show/book/etc because what was going on just made no sense or did not seem realistic in context.

Games, being slightly more escapist, have a bit of leeway from most people. But even so, in our medium it is heavily story based and it can be hard to get away with things games can sometimes get away with, unless it makes sense in context. (I am a context nut, and you asked for it. XD)

Someone falling from space and surviving would make sense in Kingdom Hearts because... well, it's Kingdom Hearts. It's goofy and kid friendly. It would be perfectly acceptable in that context. It wouldn't make as much sense in something like Grand Theft Auto. It's a much more realism based game. It may have fun glitches that break the laws of physics, but story wise... no.