"Movie" VS "Episodes" Your opinion?

[BobbyBear84]

Honestly, it depends on the story you are trying to tell. There are some where it makes more sense to release as a series of episodes, and there are some that lend themselves to being told as a larger whole.

Look at Higurashi. The nature of the story lends itself to being told in an episodic format. Each chapter does tell a complete story, but it is a smaller piece to a larger whole.

If the story doesn't have a natural episodic 'break', then it would probably work better in a longer format so that the story can be told naturally. The story should dictate the format, not the other way around. If the episodes end on an unnatural note it will throw off the natural flow of the story.

One thing about doing something in episodic format. My advice is not to release ANYTHING until all the chapters have been completed, or at least 90% done. More people are likely to check out your game if they know that there will actually be an ending released.

As for the complexity of the game... Pay attention to your workload, and if you are feeling overwhelmed. For my first game I simplified everything because I found myself drowning in different story lines. Now that it's written, I can go back, and start adding in things that I wanted before, but dropped because they were keeping me from actually finishing my game. Take your time, and don't rush yourself.

[Lumen_Astrum]

Depends on the story, in my opinion. But episodic VNs can be more detailed than the full-blown ones, so if you're writing a chapter-ish VN, episodic is good to go. But if it's something like a short story, then the full one it is.

The only trouble with making episodic VNs is that there would be several endings for each episode, but then you have to choose one "true" ending for each episode, which sort of ruins the concept of it being a VN. The only exception to this is if any "path" only brings a separate POV of the story and not a different ending, well that's fine.

I'm speaking as a player here, but I'd hate to download a huge 1GB VN (if there is such thing), unless I find it really interesting. It'd be a waste of effort to make a large VN but bore the player/s somewhere in the middle, which is just a waste of effort. Better know if they're interested from the first episodes.

(This sounds exceptionally harsh; I know. But I'm just saying from experience/observation.)

[SundownKid]

Episodes are hard to do because you have to keep a more linear plot going throughout the episodes. They work well for TV or games, but not as much for branching stories (especially carrying the choices over). I would recommend a short, self-contained story.

[PyTom]

An episodic release is not a release where the story is broken up in random places. Rather, it's one where the large project consists of a series of smaller stories. Each of the stories - but especially the first one - needs to be satisfying in its own right.

Take the case of Star Wars. Does the first movie leave things open to allow for a sequel? Sure. But at the same time, it tells a full story. If A New Hope had been the only Star Wars movie ever made, it would have been worth seeing.

An episodic VN has to be like that. You have to ask yourself - if circumstances prevent me from releasing any more of this game, will the audience feel that they were given value for their time? If the answer is no, then don't release until you have a complete story.

[leon]

I completely agree with PyTom on what episodic story is (should be?). Another fine example is Sam and Max by Telltale Games (especially season 2). Each episode is great game on its own and you can play them in any order, without missing anything or needing a "previously on ..." intro. But playing the entire season in order is an even better experience as many seemingly random things connect together into a larger plot. Perfect to lure in a busy player and get them hooked. :p

Many VNs claim to be episodic, but they are usually just longer VNs released in chunks. These may have plenty of benefits for the creators, but little for the player. I can't say I've ever seen a truly episodic VN.

[AxemRed]

I can't say I've ever seen a truly episodic VN.

Higurashi

[leon]

True, Higurashi is episodic, but it's still a different concept than Star Wars or Sam&Max episodes. I haven't played Higurashi myself, but it was mentioned a lot in a group I'm involved with, when we were discussing episodic concept...

The difference between these concepts is that you have to read Higurashi from start to end in the correct order, to follow the story, while you can play Sam&Max or watch Start Wars episodes in any order (the first movie was episode 4 anyhow) and you won't miss much.

Especially if development takes a long time (one or several years), the artwork and other things are likely to improve with each episode, so the last episode is probably the best one. This can create a dillema for the player: Should I play the first episode or the last? If watching all Star Wars movies in the right order would be required to follow the plot, I think a lot of younger viewers would not watch the new "prequel" trilogy, since they never watched the original one.

[AxemRed]

you have to read Higurashi from start to end in the correct order

Not really, you might be thinking of Higurashi Kai. The original 4 episodes are 3 what-ifs starting from the same premise and a prequel.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

We can also add Umineko then.


And half true to answer AxemRed :

If we read Watanagashi and Tatarigoroshi before Onikakushi, we would already know Satoshi's disappearance have nothing to do with Rena/Mion. So yeah not reading the 3 first in the good order isn't that important, but some things are indeed missing in the atmosphere because we already know about them, while we shouldn't. It would indeed be like not watching Star Wars in the good order.

[AlgaeDrone]

I really agree with that Edgar Allan Poe theory that it's best to keep it short. What I mean is that even if you have a very long story, it's best to break it up into smaller, bite-sized segments that someone can digest in one sitting. That way, the audience remains in the same uninterrupted mood and mindset throughout that part of the story. It's something that you see in a lot of other media (ie. books have chapters, television has episodes, etc), but something that you don't seem to see as much of in video games and VNs, which is unfortunate, I think.

[LateWhiteRabbit]

I really agree with that Edgar Allan Poe theory that it's best to keep it short. What I mean is that even if you have a very long story, it's best to break it up into smaller, bite-sized segments that someone can digest in one sitting. That way, the audience remains in the same uninterrupted mood and mindset throughout that part of the story. It's something that you see in a lot of other media (ie. books have chapters, television has episodes, etc), but something that you don't seem to see as much of in video games and VNs, which is unfortunate, I think.

The episodic nature of Telltale's The Walking Dead did this, and I think it is a big reason the game was such a massive success and resonated so much with audiences. Each episode had its own self-contained chapter of the story, with an opening hook and some kind of resolution by the end of the episode. The short nature of each episode (2-3 hours) meant most player's experienced them in uninterrupted sessions, which helped keep the tension and involvement high. Each episode was satisfying in its own right, but ended in a cliffhanger or ominous situation. This, coupled with the brilliant "Next time, on the Walking Dead...." previews that played at the end of each episode created a lot of anticipation and excitement for the next installment. And all together the player gets a final game that is 10-15 hours long.

The staggered release (1 episode every month) also gave players the time to really reflect on and discuss the characters and plot, making everything a lot more memorable than the storyline of a game you might beat in a weekend. Instead, the episodic release schedule kept people thinking and talking about the story for months on end. Players that pick up the finished package with all five episodes already released now aren't really getting the same kind of experience everyone else got, just like people that pick up the complete season of a TV show aren't getting the same experience as those that watched it week by week as it came out and discussed the show with others around the digital water cooler.

I think even for games that aren't episodic it is best to build in natural arcs, acts, and good stopping and starting places. It really is a matter of good or bad pacing. Going back to the Walking Dead again (because, seriously, it's like a VN that has won Game of the Year, and everyone making story-based games should play it), each episode has a 3 act structure -> Act 1: A Problem is Introduced or Discovered, Act 2: Complications Arise and the Stakes are Raised, Act 3: Resolution and the Solving of the Problem. The key is, the pacing works as a series because each episode has higher tension and more at stake than previous episodes. The problems introduced in each Act 1 get worse and worse and more desperate as the series goes on, until the Act 1 of the final episode acts as the climax of the entire story.

An episodic structure within a larger story allows you to repeatedly explore and reinforce the same themes and motifs. This can lead to powerful storytelling if done subtly.

[Minnfae]

I think it would be good to make one small, 'preview' VN, and a large movie style one.

[nyaatrap]

Is it "Creator Discussion" for creators here? Then I'd say don't think to make a long one. It just adds one more work in no progress. Epidemic has more chance to complete at least one.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

As long as each episode is useful for the story, it's not a problem.

[AlgaeDrone]

The episodic nature of Telltale's The Walking Dead did this, and I think it is a big reason the game was such a massive success and resonated so much with audiences. Each episode had its own self-contained chapter of the story, with an opening hook and some kind of resolution by the end of the episode. The short nature of each episode (2-3 hours) meant most player's experienced them in uninterrupted sessions, which helped keep the tension and involvement high.

...an episodic structure within a larger story allows you to repeatedly explore and reinforce the same themes and motifs. This can lead to powerful storytelling if done subtly.

The Walking Dead is definitely a very good non-game (I don't exactly know what term should be used for interactive stories like that) despite its' flaws, and I'm glad to see it's getting some positive attention. And I agree with you about how the episodic nature of The Walking Dead makes it better.

I'm less sure that I agree with what you said about how releasing sections of a game over time makes it better. I mean, it makes sense, but I think what's stopping me from fully agreeing is that I always think that the best entertainment media can be viewed at any point in time and still be as good as the day it was released. For instance, there are a lot of shows on television that are entirely about recent events, and I don't think that those will carry the same weight 1, 10, or 100 years from now. But in my mind, a great show should be as great today as it was decades ago. I guess what I mean is that I'd just like to see creators keeping in mind the question of how their creation will stand up over time. I mean, keep in mind that these are all just random thoughts zinging around inside my skull - I'm not going anywhere with this.