Getting sick of Japanese names

[SundownKid]

My only recommendation is, read books and consume media that are not anime or manga. That doesn't mean that anime is bad, but people who only watch anime will feel like the story needs some kind of tenuous relation to anime to be cool. Something is always lost in translation and the best way to experience writing is in the native language.

[Gear]

Never done that myself, oddly. I mean, I enjoy Japanese culture to an extent, but when writing a story of any kind, I'm always heading straight for names like Tim and Kyle. It never occurs to me to use a Japanese name.

[Blane Doyle]

My only recommendation is, read books and consume media that are not anime or manga. That doesn't mean that anime is bad, but people who only watch anime will feel like the story needs some kind of tenuous relation to anime to be cool. Something is always lost in translation and the best way to experience writing is in the native language.

Isn't it a good rule of creative thumb to consume media from all mediums, genres, and countries of origin?

I mean, I adore anime and manga. I watch and read them all the time. But I also read graphic novels from America, watch French cartoons, Korean films, read books from Germany, etc. (Granted all of that is translated into English if it wasn't made in it so there has got to be some loss in translation as you said.) To me, just sticking to anime and manga gets.... boring after a while, so I can't really imagine just sticking to them. Maybe I am just really weird that way.

Honestly I have absolutely no problem if someone makes something set in Japan with Japanese characters or set somewhere else with Japanese characters as long as they do their research and make them unique. That's because I expect the same for everything they write regardless of setting or character nationality. If you are American and are writing a story set in America with an American cast? I expect just as much research and effort.

I will admit it gets a little old after a while, but honestly it isn't that bad to me. Especially since, hey, I don't know if the person making this game in English with a Japanese setting or Japanese characters is American or French or Japanese or Japanese-American themselves. I don't know where they live, have lived, and what they've experienced in regards to another culture. For all I know? They're Japanese, moved to France, are making a game set in America from there, and want to have Japanese characters because of this.

So long as it's pulled off well (and by that I mean it doesn't seem completely illogical, tossed in for th e heck of it, or obviously incorrect)? I am perfectly ok with it.

But I have to admit, I do love more variety. If I see 10 games with Usagi or Kagome or Yuki and one with Amelia? I'm going to look over Amelia again. That doesn't mean that her game is going to automatically be better because it is different, the other three may be far better and much more creative. But it is different and catches my eye I suppose.

[dramspringfeald]

I don't mean to sound racist but good lord people try SOME originality. Unless you have done it then leave it alone. Unless you are making it up as you go then leave it alone. You have a culture, you have a history, you have your own worlds to show us. Tell us about YOUR fantasies not which anime expy you think would be cute to add to your story.

Back to the topic
I am perfectly fine with Japanese people using Japanese names and Japanese themes. It's your land and you know what most of the names mean and what they represent in the context of the story, but Americans/Westerners unless you LIVE in Japan, China or well just about everywhere you are allotted 1 maybe 3 non-western inspired names. I'll let it slide in the areas of little Asia because it is Asia in a bottle. The occasional Token Minority character is fine however unless you live there stick to what you know.

I get like this because most of you might not know this but NAMES mean something. they tell you who they are and usually where they are from. Why is the character named Gordon Freeman? What is the meaning of John Shepard? these are important things to have and every stroke of your pen should have purpose. If you have no grasp of the name yous you are using then cant use it to it's fullest power.

Again look at Gordon Freeman from Half Life
Gordon = "large fortification"
Freeman was usually given to Former Slaves meaning that they were now Free men.
So his name is Defender of Free men or Defender of soon to be free men. What is Half life 1 and 2 about? The defender of freedom removing humanity from slavery with a crowbar.

Hell, My last name is Sutherland Which is Scottish which means it either tells of the place my bloodline OR the Work my family use to do. It's not Smith or Baker so it's a place. Well in Scotland there is a place called Sutherland it is the Southern Land of the area. so I am *dram* of the Southern Land... see where I'm going with this?


I guess what I'm trying to say is, Stop using names you know nothing about and start using your OWN world for your games. It will come out better, it will feel more real and it will stop the rather extreme "ANIMU" feel about things, making it feel more authentic.

Also 200+ Japanese High School Dating Sims taking place in the SAME halls with the same story, with the same characters is getting old... fast

[enta]

Also 200+ Japanese High School Dating Sims taking place in the SAME halls with the same story, with the same characters is getting old... fast

THIS. I totally, super, godly agree with this. I mean JP high school dating sims are fine but it might be because I'm experiencing that very school life myself, I can't help but see contradictions here and there which leads to me dropping the game, moving on with life and forgetting about it.

And like I mentioned earlier, what irritates me the most are the forced honorifics and Japanese words(sometimes even spelled wrong!) they include in their games. Japanese-themed games are nice, I play them so long as they are bearable and works of the weeaboos are not included there. Japanese-themed games doesn't need Japanese honorifics and words if they are not written in Japanese letters and released for the Japanese-reading market. And this goes for any games in any languages in any place where it's set.

And before someone pinches in and say, "hey, you have your own Japanese-themed project too"; I've already mentioned my situation in my earlier post. Damn, I sound pretty harsh but this might be a good opportunity for people to realize that instead of imagining the Japanese life far away from your own lifestyle and culture; it would be best to write something you've experienced, you've seen and you've felt---unless you are writing something supernatural/fantasy/out-of-this-world stories.

[Donmai]

Why can't we simply do our things the way we believe it is better and let people do their things the way they prefer? They are doing things in a certain way because they saw it elsewhere and they liked what they saw. Maybe they are learning or experimenting things now and tomorrow they will naturally change their way. If our own work is so good as we believe, then one day they will see it and, if they like it, they will follow. It is their fantasy, not ours, so why don't we simply let them alone?

Smartasses thinking they know the "right" way of doing things have always been a great danger in human history (especially when they never show us what they really can do). Of course we have the right to state our opinion, but people that have the nerve to say "stop doing it this way and start doing it the 'right way'" always give me the creeps!

[Kato]

I'm a little torn on the issue. On one hand I have a game set in Japan with Japanese names and the other is set in New York with Westernised names. Although I wouldn't be one to use Japanese names outside of of Japan as a setting (unless of course if there is actually a Japanese character in said setting) I really don't see the problem with it. If the people making the game want everyone in their imaginary land of 'X' to have Japanese names then I'll accept that as much as any Western name. To be honest, most of the Non-Japan setting games I've played personally don't seem to use Japanese names all that often and I don't really see the big deal if it's Suzaku or Mark that beating on his high school bully or an ogre in the forest. If people start making games and changing everything to appeal to people thinking something is cliche, they are gonna start hating what they make, stop making it and then all we will be left with half finished shells of someones inspiration they won't be getting back...

tl;dr - People should write what they want to write, how they want to write it. If everyone worries about critics and conforming to them, the world will be a very sad, un-creative place.

[Cadenza]

I especially dislike when there are extremely Western overtones to the entire game like an all-white cast or completely avoiding any Japanese themes of any kind. Indicates an eerie level of exotification to me. I know people who are latina or desi or indeed, Asian, and people give them nicknames to avoid having to pronounce their whole name. But throw some Japanese names and suffixes into a game and whubam! How intriguing!

That's just me being touchy about race though. Cough. Generally, I think it wounds a game's ability to differentiate itself from the cookie cutter mold of "romance a cute schoolboy-kun!" that has been set for VNs.

[Cyrus]

There is no pleasing everyone. One must make the characters the way one want. Same with the location. Or else what is the point of being indie.

All this nitpicking is a moot point if the story is really good. And if it is bad, honestly, who cares what the names are.

[Carassaurat]

Personally I like that the Japanese tropes are common enough to easily take the piss out of, but not so dominant that those visual novels are unavoidable. It makes it very easy to write a comical satire of visual novels. For Origamo Furioso I just had to write a line like "my name is Toyota Mitsubishi" and BAM, easy joke. Not a joke that'll live through the centuries, but we can all have a cheap little laugh at people emulating Japan for a moment. And as far as popularity goes, outside of Katawa Shoujo, they don't even seem to be all that well known or often played.

[Donmai]

And something I forgot to add: japanese names, honorifics and other things just doesn't need to be 100% correct on the indie scene. They are references, only. This is global culture. That's how I chose my nickname: Donmai isn't a japanese word, it is japanese slang (or so they told me) that is based on English, an International language. And if the "japanese" writing on my logo may be wrong, I donmai! People using japanese names on their VNs aren't creating or recreating japanese culture, they are in fact creating a fantasized/stylized universe based on japanese themes they have seen and they have liked. This is pop culture at it's best. Hasn't japanese pop culture incorporated/recreated so many elements from other cultures with very interesting results throughout the years? Now is the "rest of the world's turn".

Also, newbies need not be ashamed to ask old questions again and again, or tell stories that had been told before, if they really like them. This is how they (we) will be learning, and this is how old themes will sometimes be recreated in inovative ways.

[PyTom]

You know, when I see a thread like this, I get the feeling that people are complaining about the taste of the free ice cream.

It's like - people get together and make the games that interest them. And you can play it or not, and you can make your own game or not. But fundamentally, I don't think a thread like this is going to change a creator's mind. We've been having this sort of conversation every couple of months for the last decade or so - I'm not sure it's worth rehashing.

[Pyonkotchi]

You know, when I see a thread like this, I get the feeling that people are complaining about the taste of the free ice cream.

idk i think a better comparison would be, you invite your friend over to make some homemade icecream and just as you pick up the chocolate, and they get upset and start screaming at you "Everyone eats chocolate! it's so overused!!! just because you're making icecream it doesn't mean it has to be chocolate!! Why not try vanilla?! or strawberry! Or even better, why don't you have some originality and try something new, like potato icecream?! why does it always have to be chocolate?!" You try to explain that you just LIKE chocolate, You think chocolate is a great idea, but they won't listen, they start telling you that people will make fun of you and assume mean things because you like chocolate. you wonder why its such a huge deal anyways. its not like they have to eat it, you're not putting chocolate in their icecream, and besides, you brought enough ingredients for them to make their own.
eventually you guys make up, its really a silly argument after all.
but then a month later you have this conversation again. :P

----
anyways, whether the characters name is kenji or john probably won't affect the story, if the story is bad it most likely has nothing to do with the main characters name.

besides new writers have all sorts of things they need help with, so why not help them with that instead of fussing over the characters names :y

[dramspringfeald]

To fill in some of the Japanese people on here.

In the US, Yes America = burgers and meat. That's rather close. we love meat and normally 2 out of 3 meals is mostly meat or all meat. Most towns, cities and random stretches of road have either a stake house or a Burger joint. Not making this up, Live in a town of about 800, 6 burger chains 5 restaurants and even the "Asian" all you can eat serve burgers and meat.

Honorifics - In the states, at least, Mr; Mrs; Ms are rarely used unless in a formal setting. Like a doctors office or talking to the Boss at work. For most though it feels a little like the "Mr. Anderson" scene from the matrix or getting called to the Principal's office. Commonly used with last name only and if used with first and last name then yeah you might be in trouble.

Milady, Is not used but Mam is and more so the further "south" you get. However depending on the location it can be read as "Old Woman" and is usually used for addressing older women. Though in the south it can and is often used for just about any female. It's also handy if you forget her name. You sound ultra polite and it is.

Senior, Sir is more common but depending on the location it can be read as "Old guy" and is usually used for Adults. Also a good go to if you forget his name. Both are almost never used in a Student to Student conversation.

Junior is never used. We use their first name or nickname if they have been given one. In high school it is not uncommon for them to have freshmen, they are like interns. Heck in high school I had my own freshmen.

the Honorifics are really only used until you know and remember their name... except mam, if you went to a southern school it IS your go to for just about everyone. "Yes mam," "No mam," "Mam?" and "Mam!"


As for the Asian name thing, Remember NAMES have MEANING. A character names Judas is only going to end one way.

anyways, whether the characters name is kenji or john probably won't affect the story, if the story is bad it most likely has nothing to do with the main characters name.

.... YOU and people like you are the reason for this entire conversation.

besides new writers have all sorts of things they need help with, so why not help them with that instead of fussing over the characters names :y

We abandoned "Character Names" a while ago. We are talking about the entire use of culture and the lack of either respect or knowledge about the subject. With your previous statement you are saying It is fine if we use the name Hitler in a comedy and a positive light because it is a name or calling the cowardly spy character Geronimo is cool because it has no meaning. This shows either a lack of knowledge on the subject they are writing about OR they are extremely racist and trolling.

You know, when I see a thread like this, I get the feeling that people are complaining about the taste of the free ice cream.

...the same free Ice cream everyday, 7 days a week, 54 weeks a year since "ice cream" came out and the only difference between them is some are hand made and some are made by machines with hundreds of "New" ice cream ideas all the same flavor each month

[Aines445]

idk i think a better comparison would be, you invite your friend over to make some homemade icecream and just as you pick up the chocolate, and they get upset and start screaming at you "Everyone eats chocolate! it's so overused!!! just because you're making icecream it doesn't mean it has to be chocolate!! Why not try vanilla?! or strawberry! Or even better, why don't you have some originality and try something new, like potato icecream?! why does it always have to be chocolate?!" You try to explain that you just LIKE chocolate, You think chocolate is a great idea, but they won't listen, they start telling you that people will make fun of you and assume mean things because you like chocolate. you wonder why its such a huge deal anyways. its not like they have to eat it, you're not putting chocolate in their icecream, and besides, you brought enough ingredients for them to make their own.
eventually you guys make up, its really a silly argument after all.
but then a month later you have this conversation again.

XD The best part is that I don't like chocolate, so it's kind of weird to make it chocolate since I'm cool with japanese stuff.


Honestly, I kind of don't like to put japanese stuff because I don't want to disrespect someone, like I once had this idea that focused on japanese mythology and I was researching hard for it, but then I decided to leave it alone. I kind of pick names for my characters without meaning to them, like how I don't know the meaning of my own name <.< (Sometimes they have a meaning though). And even if I were to make a game with my country as it's setting, what would I talk about? Financial crisis? How no one likes to vote now? My country is not really interesting (Yeah...I like fantasy). This topic reminded me of how I see a lot of english in japanese things (If I'm wrong then I'm very sorry) so why can't others do the opposite?