Violence?

[DaFool]

Gratuitous is also fine.

Has anyone seen the first episode of Devil May Cry? Now that is stylistic entertainment. It is not unique -- heck it felt like Gungrave -- and having blood splatter all over the place wasn't really essential in driving the plot. But it's animation we're talking about, but aren't VNs also visual media?

So I guess I can't really comment except that, whatever rules you break, make sure you do it in a manner that is pretty darn cool. If you don't think you can cut it, then just tone it down since understated modest approaches rarely totally fail.

[F.I.A]

I think it rather depends on the way the violences are implemented. For example, in Tsukihime, headless and sometimes disemboweled corpses are described everywhere, but never displayed graphically. However, not really many are bothered with that.

For many, I think their acceptance goes like these:

Blown up heartless villains - YAY!
Blown up innocent girls - HECK NO!

For me, I have seen much spleen not to be bothered, unless they are "top-notched" guro material...

[Ignosco]

1. For me, violence has to fit the storyline and be in character (ie non-gratuitous) if it's going to be part of a VN. But also since VN's can imply things so strongly without representing them visually - if a scene can be expressed better through implication then by graphical depiction, then use words to describe it.

2. Depends on how it fits into the story - the content probably won't offend me though...

[papillon]

Since there is a murder mystery going on, FH does have a few CGs that include blood. Violence is generally off-screen, though. Especially if it's game-over character death - there'll be a hint that something horrible is about to happen to you and then we'll fade to black, leaving the exact details to your imagination.

I've read some hurt/comfort fanfic that can get quite vicious in describing the details of a character's pain. In those stories it's a 'plot necessity' because often the whole idea is that it's this horrible pain torture whatever experience that breaks the character down enough for them to do otherwise out-of-character things, like get together with whatever romantic interest the author has in mind. And it's really sort of... lame, that way. I'd much rather see people put together through an interesting plot and character development than through one of them being completely broken.

But if someone makes a game that is all about slave-training and torment, I won't complain, as long as it's clearly labeled so that people can avoid it if they do not want to see any of that!

In general, I'm not a big fan of nastiness. Kill Bill got very quickly switched off, never to be mentioned again.

[absinthe]

1- Can you stand the idea of violence (not necessarily sexual) in a renai/dating/bl game etc.?

Sure, not a problem. I think I've yet to write a game where someone didn't get punched, shot, bitten, or otherwise injured. Hm. I just noticed that.

2- If you can: How much?

I'd say quite a bit. Everything depends on the context and the story. Regular old violence, say, straight action movies? I can handle it. Grotesque, horrific, pointless violence like Saw? Can't even bear to watch the trailers. Now, the line isn't clear, at all, and what squicks me out might not make the next person even bat an eye.

Sexual violence is an iffy issue. Handled right in a fictional context, it can work. Depends on what goal you're aiming for, what tone you're setting, and what effect you're trying to achieve. As a general rule, though, I'd say it's not really something I'm interested in reading about/playing through.

Which is pretty odd, because one of the pieces I'm working on right now features a fairly violent rape scene, but you have to really work to see it. Why? Because it's the logical way to end the game if you make the choice to follow a fairly aggressive path too far, and because the scene is effective in the context of the story.

Not a simple subject at all, I'm afraid! I think you just have to write what you feel the story requires, and accept that not everyone will be thrilled with it.

P.S - Does anyone know any good free music sites?

Oh, definitely! Well, if by 'free' you mean Creative Commons licensed!

For mostly modern pieces, try Podsafe Audio and CCMixter. For a mix, including classical pieces, Magnatune is an incredible resource.

Also, Artist Server has some nice work, but you have to really hunt for suitably licensed pieces among the copyrighted stuff.

And definitely double-check the licenses for each piece to ensure that your particular use is legitimate under that license.

In general, I'm not a big fan of nastiness. Kill Bill got very quickly switched off, never to be mentioned again.

Lucky you. I got dragged to the theater by my two best buds who swore I'd love it, that it wasn't to be missed, and that it was very artistic. For them, yes, I could see it being enjoyable. For me, with my dismemberment and enucleation issues, it wasn't pretty. And some of the worst ("nasty" is the right word) things were things that, as guys, they hadn't even really registered at all, let alone as horrific. I was shaking for two hours afterwards.

[MsDuck]

P.S - Does anyone know any good free music sites?

Oh, definitely! Well, if by 'free' you mean Creative Commons licensed!

For mostly modern pieces, try Podsafe Audio and CCMixter. For a mix, including classical pieces, Magnatune is an incredible resource.

Also, Artist Server has some nice work, but you have to really hunt for suitably licensed pieces among the copyrighted stuff.

And definitely double-check the licenses for each piece to ensure that your particular use is legitimate under that license.

Thank you very, very much!!

[Lambda '00']

Umm... If you don't like violence & some blood, you won't like to play my game (when released)

[MsDuck]

Umm... If you don't like violence & some blood, you won't like to play my game (when released)

Were you referring to me or on of the others?

I, personally, have an unhealthy bloodlust and would love to see your game when it comes out.

"Can't make a Bloody Mary without blood."

[chisa-chan]

Violence is fine with me, although I am not really the type who like violence so much. (Note: as the violence level in Togainu no Chi, I can still get over it.)

[PrettySammy09]

Sorry, but, as a woman, I find those who enjoy rape as a form of entertainment tasteless.

Statistics show that in the United States, one in four women will be a victim of sexual assault or rape. When I think about those stats and realize that I may very well be a victim of that sort of attack, I find the fact that people find entertainment value in it makes me a little sick.

I'm sorry if I offended anyone with my opinion.

[Jake]

Statistics show that in the United States, one in four women will be a victim of sexual assault or rape.

Hmm. That looks like the kind of statistic presented by women's groups to make the problem appear larger than it really is...

I don't mean to belittle the victims of rape, of course, but bear in mind when thinking about that statistic that 'assault' is a very wide term - IIRC you can [legally speaking] 'assault' someone just by shouting at them loudly, in some contexts. Without clarification, I would expect 'sexual assault' could possibly run from everything to rape-in-all-but-name at one end to include things like unwanted wolf-whistles at the other. Certainly it can include an unwanted pat on the bum, which - while still an invasion of personal space and not something to be encouraged - is so far a cry from rape it's practically insulting to include it in the same statistic.


Still, that's a little off-topic. To get back on... personally, I see rape very much in the same kind of light as murder, as far as entertainment goes. I don't want to watch a movie that consists of nothing but gratuitous rape scenes, and I don't want to watch a movie that consists of nothing but gratuitous murders, either. That said, a rape can develop a story just as well as a murder can, so I also wouldn't want to rule it out entirely.
Simply put, practically anything included in a story purely for the sake of including it - be it murder or rape, fast cars, giant robots or vampires - tends to diminish that story. I'm not sure I like the thought of people who enjoy watching rape purely because it's rape, but I would say that it's perfectly reasonable and quite normal to enjoy a good, well-constructed story that revolves around a rape, for example - I wouldn't rule it out entirely from all forms of entertainment in every way.

[DaFool]

Statistics show that in the United States, one in four women will be a victim of sexual assault or rape.

Some other statistics also claim that 3 out of 4 girls will be molested by the time they are 18.

I've long dismissed statistics put by radical women's groups, since they are blatantly false and over-report on everything. And especially since false claims have put many innocent men behind bars and utterly ruined their lives.

Besides, there are more men-on-men rape in prisons anyway, and the majority of them are unreported.

But definitely, I don't find rape entertaining. Rape-play, on the other hand...

[PrettySammy09]

Still, that's a little off-topic. To get back on... personally, I see rape very much in the same kind of light as murder, as far as entertainment goes. I don't want to watch a movie that consists of nothing but gratuitous rape scenes, and I don't want to watch a movie that consists of nothing but gratuitous murders, either. That said, a rape can develop a story just as well as a murder can, so I also wouldn't want to rule it out entirely.
Simply put, practically anything included in a story purely for the sake of including it - be it murder or rape, fast cars, giant robots or vampires - tends to diminish that story. I'm not sure I like the thought of people who enjoy watching rape purely because it's rape, but I would say that it's perfectly reasonable and quite normal to enjoy a good, well-constructed story that revolves around a rape, for example - I wouldn't rule it out entirely from all forms of entertainment in every way.

Agreed. Basically just saying, "I want to make a gory game just for the sake of being violent and cool!" never works out. Let the violence be a part of the story, not the other way around.

[Wintermoon]

Murder can be justified in some cases. Rape cannot. Therefore I have a lot less tolerance for rape than for murder, even though the latter is the "bigger" crime.

I don't find violence inherently interesting. If a story needs violence, by all means put it in. However, excessive violence is just boring.

[Jake]

Murder can be justified in some cases.

Hmm. Yes, but then it tends not to be called 'murder', getting labelled instead 'self defence' or 'manslaughter' or 'war' or something similar. When I was talking about murder, above, I was really meaning specifically the set of things which would have you convicted of murder in a criminal court, which doesn't include things like acting in self-defence.

There's the set of hypothetical scenarios where it's morally-justifiable to murder someone to prevent them from doing something even worse - the old "If you could go back in time and shoot Hitler dead when he was ten, would you?" thing - but frankly, you're then into the realms of academic vagary that might also come up with "it's best to rape this girl so she hates me so that later on in the series when she has to kill me so she doesn't die herself she doesn't get really sad about it afterwards"...