Visual Novel with an anti-hero protagonist?

[LunarVN]

I'm curious to know if this has been done very often. I'm brainstorming for a project right now and the more I think about it... the more I'd like to have the main character be, well... not a hero. I think it would be really interesting to have a main character in the vein of Light Yagami from Death Note. But would this work well in a visual novel? Would people enjoy playing as someone who can potentially make some pretty horrific decisions?

I haven't settled on anything concrete, but I'd love to hear some thought and opinions on this subject. For instance, do you think it would be better to have an "evil" or "renegade" path as well as a "good" one? Or would it be more interesting to have a character that is clearly defined and the choices are more like... "evil" and "slightly less evil". I say evil but in reality I think the story I'm crafting would justify these "bad" actions much like an anti-hero. Not necessarily a villain.

One dilemma I have about this kind of story is that it doesn't leave a lot of room for romantic relationships. It could lead to a lot of messed up situations where the main character is using a love interest (much like Misa from Death Note... sorry, it's the best comparison I can think of right now). It could be interesting to play with relationships like that... but it could also come off as a bit... dark.

[Mad Harlequin]

A VN about an antihero would be interesting---but Light Yagami isn't a good comparison for that purpose because he's a villain protagonist. I think you could easily pull off an antihero, however, as you'd just be writing a morally gray character who's done questionable things, but may also want to do heroic deeds. And there's plenty of room for romance. Catwoman is a good example of an antihero.

A VN about a villain protagonist wold be much more difficult, because if you offer players a choice between good and evil, they become complicit in that choice. I get a little anxious when I think about certain potential choices, though, because there's an unstated encouragement of that behavior going on. (As you noted, Misa's love for Light is exploited.) So if you go into darker territory, there should be a good reason for it, and the main character should suffer as a result.

[plainviewer]

I recently made a reply talking about the concepts of "good and evil" choices in games, which you'll find relevant to your question. You can find it pasted below.

http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... =4&t=30778

Now assuming you've just read it, now you know my stance on giving players good and evil choices. Despite their frequent use in games, it's time to abandon the superficial labels, and offer more organic experiences, leaving the player to decide what decisions were "heroic/evil, good/bad."

An anti-hero isn't difficult to write. They have a noble goal they're trying to accomplish (at least to them) but aren't trying to do so by conventional means. At this point, what separates anti-heroes from villains, is the former has a sense of morals and ethics. Villains are indifferent to whom they hurt along the way.

The other poster was right, Yagami was a villain, not an anti-hero. The reason you probably thought he was, is because he wasn't evil just for the sake of being evil. He had his own justifications, no matter how twisted they may have been.

Reason I think people are veering away from heroes in favor of anti-heroes, is that the former these days are being poorly written, i.e., boring. There's not enough struggle or moral dilemma. Usually the worst thing that happens to them is a loved one gets taken hostage, but 9/10 times, they'll rescue them in the end anyway.

If you want an unconventional perspective on what it means to be a hero, I recommend you visit the wiki of the game Spec Ops the Line. Not the most popular game, but its messages were very important, and not ones that are covered enough in stories, or in games at least.

[ludeshka]

I haven't heard of many VNs with antihero/villain protagonists, but my all time favourite VN happens to have one!

WINTER SHARD!! https://vndb.org/v1960 There, check it out.

But really, I think it could be very interesting if you just go wild and write it.

As for romance, there are so many possibilities, and it could help you branch your plot. Maybe love can redeem your villain. Maybe they have a very evil but very sexy boss they work for, then fall for. ^^
Maybe the MC starts the story in an established relationship, and doesn't want their lover to know of their villainy. (Like, a supervillain dates a "mundane" but only on their "civilian" identity.)

So many possibilities. <3

If you're worried about people not being interested in playing "evil" characters, I think you shouldn't be! If you write it well, it can be awesome!

[firecat]

my novel had a evil protagonist and a hero protagonist, people liked the evil protagonist more than the hero. everything i did to the villain was the same old unlucky events like unable to kill the hero, being annoyed with fail plans and side-villains that are worthless. people still like the villain more even with all the bad events and stuff.

[trooper6]

the protagonist for the VN I'm working on is probably best described as a villain. And I want to see how the player deals with that. Actually, now that I think about it...I'm getting a few ideas for a separate project.

Anyway, my answer to this question is the same answer I give every time someone asks, "Can I do this?"

Do what ever you want to do. Do it well and do it thoughtfully.

[truefaiterman]

The fact that you took a crazy genocidal murderer with a deity complex as an "Anti-hero" is just telling you how to play with a more morally ambiguous character, if not down-right evil. It's all about developing the story about your main character's morals, showing that they DO have a reason to commit certain acts (a lot of times they don't even have to be portrayed as good, either). It's about putting you in the shoes of the character, allowing you to understand how that person thinks.

With that said, other posters already told you how a "basic" anti-hero works. If you want to see some examples, I'm thinking right now about Emya Kiritsugu from Fate/Zero (who is already closer than villain than hero, being more of a mercyless extremist).

If you want to see an example about darker main characters... My #1 example will always be Saya no Uta, with on of the most twisted and... oh well. The TV Series Dexter may help you too.

[burnt_offering]

How the hell has no-one brought up G-Senjou?

Yes, it's been done, and yes, it works.

[LunarVN]

Haha, thanks for the replies so far. Light Yagami might not have been the best example of an anti-hero. When I mentioned him, it was as an example of "someone who can potentially make some pretty horrific decisions". Light doesn't start out as a villain in my opinion. And though I'm not sure I'd take my story to the extreme that Death Note does... those are the kind of decisions that I'd be interested in hearing feedback about. Having a main character decide to kill his pursuers, even if they're just doing their job. Or using another character like Light uses Misa. All with "noble" intentions. But how far do you go with giving those decisions to the player? If the main character comes off as villainous in all of his dialogue... would there even be a choice to give the player? Why would that character make a "good" choice? I suppose it could start like Death Note, where the main character doesn't really start out with any "good" or "bad" intentions. I certainly intend to make the choices and the story a lot more ambiguous than "good" and "bad". But I don't want to force choices on the player if the main character seems so obviously set on one course of action. But at the same time... you want the main character to be interesting...

[Godline]

Light could be a good anti-hero example really, now that you brought up about how he was at the start. I mean he DID have good intentions, they just got warped.

Speaking of good intentions getting warped (errr, maybe)... we've got one: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 50&t=30869

So look out for that.

[annpan]

Maybe you should look at Lelouch?

[firecat]

yes lelouch is a good example, hes good but people view him as a terrorist. the touhou has a lot of anti-heros who just wanted to do something but aren't allow. one last example is cichol from mabinogi, he been seen as a villain but has you continue on with the story, you see that he only wants peace.

[caiooa]

In visual novel realm, maybe Saya no uta? While the player can control Fuminori just 2 times in the whole VN, it have some pretty horrific decisions...

[n0tgin]

Hey, love isn't just for heroes!
People who aren't heroes fall in love too, I feel like we have this presumption that love is something only good people can feel. That's not true! Anyone can feel love! Whether for their family or for romantic partners, love is possible! Every villain is a hero in their mind and thus, they can love and be loved too. I feel like this is something people should write about more...

[namastaii]

People enjoy playing the bad guy. For instance, grand theft auto.