Insane and cancelled

[ChillTaco]

Im new to vn's but Im not new to working on games. The people I used to work with had me in as the idea/sprite/co-director/co-writer/concept artist. I did a lot of shit, and I thought up a lot of things that were borderline insane, but I always assumed thats what made games cool as hell.

I mean, thats what sets games apart and makes plots worth reading right? But how insane is to insane. Sometimes I wonder if perhaps my ideas got cancelled cause people couldn't handle them. But safe games are bull shit, its safe games that permeate and overbear on the market to be honest. I'm sick of all the clones out there yea?

In the case of VN's, I have come to notice forsaking of plot for the gain of TNA. Im not gunna lie, Ive played very few VN's. Why? cause they looked stupid as shit. I would name the number of stupid as shit ideas If seen here, or stupid as shit Vn's already made but in this stuffy place, Ima get massive backlash lol. Im a pretty offensive person.

But Im getting off topic. Insane man. I have worked on many games but the number of them completed is 3. You wana know if they got released? The answer is no. My team was a group of idiots. Im pretty stupid myself, Im shit at programming. The number of ideas I tossed around were mostly tossed out though, and most games we would start on were cancelled. And I mean cancelled right quick.

An example of a game we worked on that got cancelled was a lil' thing named Curse of Dogs. Basic plot, lots of fun imo. You played as the incarnation of Disco Soul, there was a dance tournament in an arcade and you came to bust out your moves and spread that fever. But you got a lil' to hype in your moves and crashed into an old arcade machine. When you woke you found yourself in cloths that didn't fit your disco groove. Dancing your way to an ancient building near by you find an ancient sword. Pulling it out felt sexy so you kept it with you.

My favorite part of the game was when the sword shot disco balls at the bosses and made them dance a groove. It was funny cause everything looked serious but the concept was retard.



Anyway was cancelled for being stupid as shit in concept.

And I thought that was fine, till one day after a while I realized I leaned how to make pixel art for the sole purpose of making a game for people to play. I worked day in and day out on assets and they all went to shit. Anyway I got sick of it and decided to try a different game genre. My ideas are still pretty stupid, I actually ended up cancelling my first game I wanted to shit out.

So What is your most Insane Idea shit out?

[Mad Harlequin]

Anyway, ["Curse of Dogs"] was cancelled for being stupid as shit in concept.

And I thought that was fine, till one day after a while I realized I leaned how to make pixel art for the sole purpose of making a game for people to play. I worked day in and day out on assets and they all went to shit. Anyway I got sick of it and decided to try a different game genre. My ideas are still pretty stupid, I actually ended up cancelling my first game.

Look, most people are going to have some ideas that aren't great with a capital G at first. But it's important to persevere and finish them, if possible, because it's part of maturing as a creator, no matter what your hobby is. In order to grow, you have to do something. I actually think "Curse of Dogs" sounds pretty neat. So give your ideas a chance.

I don't really have anything "insane" planned---ambitious, perhaps, but not "insane."

[firecat]

my insane idea was "All hail Google", the story of everyday internet live that fits into real live events. cars will be racers, people will be avatars that can see their profile, death is game over until you revive which cost like 1 billion gold (thats a lot of money), trolls are the bad guys, police are adam (same thing i guess), and Google is GOD.

but that's a silly idea.

[Kuiper]

"Insane" is a pretty subjective term. I find it's much easier for me personally to quantify things in terms of familiar and unfamiliar. Blending familiar elements with unfamiliar elements is often how you get an interesting story. A story that is 100% unfamiliar can be confusing, and a story that is 100% familiar can be boring. If you have a story that is a 90/10 split of unfamiliar and familiar elements, the impact of the unfamiliar elements can actually be heightened, because you have the ability to contrast them with a "normal" reference point.

There is no "correct" ratio when it comes to blending familiar and unfamiliar elements, and readers in different genres will have different expectations. For example, someone who reads regency romance novels is probably looking for something that is 95% familiar and 5% unfamiliar. When you pick up a Jane Austen novel, you generally know what to expect going in. If you've read the first few chapters of Pride and Prejudice, you can probably predict how the story is going to end. And that's perfectly fine: there are plenty of people who like familiar stories.

On the other hand, if you're writing science fiction, you'll probably be something closer to 80% unfamiliar with 20% familiar. This, of course, is not a hard-and-fast rule. If you're writing a space opera, then your story may be closer to a 50/50 blend, and if you're writing an experimental story that takes place on an alien world devoid of any species that would be familiar to a human audience, you get much deeper into the unfamiliar camp. The point is that people who pick up a science fiction will generally have a much greater tolerance for the weird--in fact, many people who read science fiction read SF specifically because they like to experience weird and unfamiliar worlds.

One common story concept approach is "unfamiliar twist on a familiar concept." For example, Hatoful Boyfriend is an otome game which combines a familiar concept (a girl goes to school with a bunch of boys, who can potentially become romance options) with an unexpected twist (all of the boys are birds). Another approach is to take two familiar concepts and combine them in an unexpected way. Mix one part regency romance and one part modern zombie literature, and the result is Pride and Prejudice and Zombies. It's actually become very common to market new works as a mix of two familiar ideas. "It's X meets Y!"

When creating stories set in unfamiliar worlds, it's okay to deviate heavily from reality, but having internal consistency is usually pretty important. For example, if on page 10 you establish the truth that "all dogs have two heads," then I'll willingly accept that premise. However, if fifty pages later, you posit that "all dogs are headless," I'll reject that idea and it will take me out of the story, not because the idea of a dog with no head is outlandish, but because it contradicts what I've been told about the fictional universe.

Another rule that I like to follow is that "audiences will accept the impossible, but not the implausible." I can accept a world where someone can conjure fireballs by waving their hands or reciting an incantation. But if the main character pulls out a handgun and shoots someone six times in the chest from 100 meters away with perfect accuracy, that's going to take me out of the story.

[trooper6]

I think the advantage of you being an idea/sprite/co-director/co-writer/concept artist here in renpy land is that you can make your games completely on your own and do whatever insane thing you want to do and not have to worry about anyone trying to veto your concept.

Follow your dream, make the games you want to make.

[Katy133]

As animation critic JesuOtaku put it, "Execution can make of break it. You can take an idea that's sounds half-baked and run with it. Or, you can take an idea that sounds brilliant and kill it dead."

For example, compare The Fairy Tale Police Department versus The Wolf Among Us. Same concept/premise (detective genre meets fairy tale characters), very different execution (one's a series for young children, the other's a video game's aimed at adults).

Also, ChillTaco, please see the Rules and Moderation Policy Thread for behaviour on this forum. No offense, but you said "sh*t" like twelve times on that one post alone.

[Taleweaver]

I'd have to agree with Katy133 on your language. Fewer four-letter words would definitely improve your post.

As for really insane ideas for projects - "Inside / Outside" comes to mind, essentially a one-button game where you control a guy with a split personality, one side passive, composed and cautious, the other violent, ruthless and aggressive. Your life throws bastards, abuse and unfairness into your way, and you get to decide when to "flip the switch" and let your darker side "handle" the problem. If you never let it out, however, it will break out at times, possibly in situations where you don't want it to.

Why I never made it? I tried writing it, and it came out some awkward mix between an ultraviolent exploitation flick and some emo drama. Not exactly a crowd-pleaser.

[synedraacus]

Insane ideas are nice as long as they become actual damn games. Think "Vangers" or "Pathologic", or anything by Tale of Tales. There are two 'but's, though:
1) Actual games means actual games, with gameplay, assets, texts, sound, code and whatever. Things people can download and play, not ranting in forums.
2) It must be weird for a reason, not just a pile of weirdness for weirdness' sake.

[trooper6]

2) It must be weird for a reason, not just a pile of weirdness for weirdness' sake.

Weirdness for weirdness's sake is not my cup of tea. Well... I love David Lynch and people think he's pretty weird...though I think all the weirdness is done deliberately, with coherency in tone, and for artistic effect. I don't really like the: this is so random for no reason sort of thing...dude! Let's have an explosion of beer burst out of that dude's butt as his special attack! Heh heh.

Not my thing.

On the other hand, there is probably an audience who would love exactly that gonzo weirdness for weirdness sake. So, I always advocate people following their vision...even if it isn't my cup of tea...because I want more diversity in what VNs can be...and I bet there is a audience out there somewhere for whatever is made.

[ChillTaco]

Man I really gota read the rules before posting on random form sites I decide to invade with my crass nature. Ill try to clean it up for the kiddies and mature.

[Katy133]

I think any idea, no matter how weird/insane, can work, so long as it's in the right hands.

I mean, I've already made Three Guys That Paint. I can only create more sane works from here on out, right?

[sasquatchii]

I recently read a post on In Focus about the importance of new ideas, and how ideas are like ugly babies, according to Pixar.

Every one of Pixar's ideas starts out as "an ugly baby." A new idea or thought or story is hard to define initially, so it's usually not very attractive upon conception. Hard as it might be to believe, even Toy Story, Up, & Finding Nemo were all "ugly babies" at one point. It's up to creators to nurture and protect their ideas, and let them grow into something new.

Pixar, like all other story tellers and creators, also makes mistakes along the way, and that's completely OK! Pixar's creators struggled for a while before getting Toy Story right. Woody was originally a cynical jerk who was sarcastic and unlikeable and would stop at nothing to eliminate Buzz Lightyear.

My point is, is that it's cool to let your ideas be "ugly" or weird or insane or whatever adjective you want to call them. Everyone has failures along the way, and that's completely natural. It's what you do with those failures (and how you overcome & learn from them) that counts.

[YossarianIII]

Every one of Pixar's ideas starts out as "an ugly baby." A new idea or thought or story is hard to define initially, so it's usually not very attractive upon conception. Hard as it might be to believe, even Toy Story, Up, & Finding Nemo were all "ugly babies" at one point. It's up to creators to nurture and protect their ideas, and let them grow into something new.

I've never heard this comparison before, but I like it!



Personally, I'll take "weird for the sake of being weird" over "normal for the sake of making money" any day of the week, although I'd agree that the best weirdness usually does have some sort of dramatic or thematic focus.

Plus, has anyone looked at the mainstream lately? It's super duper weird and always has been. Anyone who thinks that "safe" is the best way to become popular might want to consider that "Gangnam Style" has been seen by more humans than pretty much anything ever.