What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

A place to discuss things that aren't specific to any one creator or game.
Forum rules
Ren'Py specific questions should be posted in the Ren'Py Questions and Annoucements forum, not here.
Message
Author
User avatar
namastaii
Eileen-Class Veteran
Posts: 1308
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 8:35 pm
Projects: Template Maker for Ren'Py, What Life
Github: lunalucid
Skype: Discord: lunalucid#1991
Soundcloud: deadseed
itch: lunalucid
Location: USA
Contact:

What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#1 Post by namastaii » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:32 pm

When it comes to releasing visual novel/otome games etc

What are some Don'ts you have seen in games you've played? Things that are unappealing to you? What are your favorite things about a VN? Anyone want to share some Do's and Don'ts?

User avatar
trooper6
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 3645
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:33 pm
Projects: A Close Shave
Location: Medford, MA
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#2 Post by trooper6 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:40 pm

Do: Follow your own artistic vision.
Don't: Make your game based on what you think everyone else wants to see.
A Close Shave:
*Last Thing Done (Aug 17): Finished coding emotions and camera for 4/10 main labels.
*Currently Doing: Coding of emotions and camera for the labels--On 5/10
*First Next thing to do: Code in all CG and special animation stuff
*Next Next thing to do: Set up film animation
*Other Thing to Do: Do SFX and Score (maybe think about eye blinks?)
Check out My Clock Cookbook Recipe: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 51&t=21978

User avatar
namastaii
Eileen-Class Veteran
Posts: 1308
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 8:35 pm
Projects: Template Maker for Ren'Py, What Life
Github: lunalucid
Skype: Discord: lunalucid#1991
Soundcloud: deadseed
itch: lunalucid
Location: USA
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#3 Post by namastaii » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:04 pm

I just wanted opinions. For fun... I'm not making a game based off of peoples comments...
Just what people simply like and don't like.

User avatar
trooper6
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 3645
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:33 pm
Projects: A Close Shave
Location: Medford, MA
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#4 Post by trooper6 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:12 pm

You misunderstand, I wasn't critiquing your question, I was answering it!
I don't like it when people make games based on what they think everyone else will like (oh...I have to use this art style, it has to have this element, etc)--that is a big don't for me. It results in uninspired and generic work.
And I do like it when people make games based on their own artistic vision. That is a big do for me. Even if the work isn't always successful, it is always more interesting.
A Close Shave:
*Last Thing Done (Aug 17): Finished coding emotions and camera for 4/10 main labels.
*Currently Doing: Coding of emotions and camera for the labels--On 5/10
*First Next thing to do: Code in all CG and special animation stuff
*Next Next thing to do: Set up film animation
*Other Thing to Do: Do SFX and Score (maybe think about eye blinks?)
Check out My Clock Cookbook Recipe: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 51&t=21978

User avatar
namastaii
Eileen-Class Veteran
Posts: 1308
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 8:35 pm
Projects: Template Maker for Ren'Py, What Life
Github: lunalucid
Skype: Discord: lunalucid#1991
Soundcloud: deadseed
itch: lunalucid
Location: USA
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#5 Post by namastaii » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:26 pm

Hahaha I totally thought it was satire. XD I see. Yeah, I do believe everyone should do stuff not based on what they think people like lol Variety is more interesting. Unique is more interesting.

User avatar
trooper6
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 3645
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:33 pm
Projects: A Close Shave
Location: Medford, MA
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#6 Post by trooper6 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:46 pm

namastaii wrote:Hahaha I totally thought it was satire. XD I see. Yeah, I do believe everyone should do stuff not based on what they think people like lol Variety is more interesting. Unique is more interesting.
And honestly, it is one of my biggest pet peeves. There are, IMO, way too many VNs that are following the conventional wisdom of what is supposed to be good. And it gets boring. Show me something I haven't seen already!
A Close Shave:
*Last Thing Done (Aug 17): Finished coding emotions and camera for 4/10 main labels.
*Currently Doing: Coding of emotions and camera for the labels--On 5/10
*First Next thing to do: Code in all CG and special animation stuff
*Next Next thing to do: Set up film animation
*Other Thing to Do: Do SFX and Score (maybe think about eye blinks?)
Check out My Clock Cookbook Recipe: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 51&t=21978

User avatar
firecat
Miko-Class Veteran
Posts: 540
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:20 pm
Completed: The Unknowns Saga series
Projects: The Unknown Saga series
Tumblr: bigattck
Deviantart: bigattck
Skype: bigattck firecat
Soundcloud: bigattck-firecat
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#7 Post by firecat » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:59 pm

my do's and don'ts are:

do: make original VN stories, make sex scenes better (i know i'm bad for saying such thing), make mini-games fun, and tell which one is the bad ending / true ending.

don't: copy same old character traits from another VN, don't make sex scenes 1 minute long (no one likes them for 1min), never take out save button, don't make mini-games a requirement, and never try to sell stuff that can be easy obtained with a few hours of work.
Image


Image


special thanks to nantoka.main.jp and iichan_lolbot

User avatar
SundownKid
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 2299
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:50 pm
Completed: Icebound, Selenon Rising Ep. 1-2
Projects: Selenon Rising Ep. 3-4
Organization: Fastermind Games
Deviantart: sundownkid
Location: NYC
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#8 Post by SundownKid » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:09 pm

Do: Reserve a lot of time and/or money for marketing
Don't: Soft launch a game with barely any fanfare (kinda defeats the point of making one)

Do: Write a full outline before you start writing
Don't: Just wing it.

User avatar
fleet
Eileen-Class Veteran
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:25 pm
Deviantart: fleetp
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#9 Post by fleet » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:43 pm

Do: Have fun.
Do: Use a speller and grammar checker on dialog.
Don't make your first VN a big project.
Don't release your VN without having it Beta-tested by at least one other person.
All of my VNs are at http://wolflore.net
Some are at http://www.the-new-lagoon.com. NSFW
Poorly done hand-drawn art is still poorly done art. Be a Poser (or better yet, use DAZ Studio 3D) - dare to be different.

User avatar
RokAbiel
Regular
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2015 11:01 am
Projects: Galaktika Gamble
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#10 Post by RokAbiel » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:40 pm

trooper6 wrote:You misunderstand, I wasn't critiquing your question, I was answering it!
I don't like it when people make games based on what they think everyone else will like (oh...I have to use this art style, it has to have this element, etc)--that is a big don't for me. It results in uninspired and generic work.
And I do like it when people make games based on their own artistic vision. That is a big do for me. Even if the work isn't always successful, it is always more interesting.
This makes me happy, because I often worry that my art style isn't what people would want to see in a visual novel haha..People often tell me that my shading is "interesting", but nothing more than that, so I automatically assume people don't like it since I don't have many active followers on my dA account.


As for my opinion on Do and Don't:

Do: Reserve time to work on your project, even if it only makes just a small amount of progress over-all.
Don't: Push all the work on other people and claim it as your own.
Image

User avatar
Mad Harlequin
Eileen-Class Veteran
Posts: 1068
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:55 am
Projects: Emma: A Lady's Maid (editor)
IRC Nick: MadHarlequin
Location: Gotham City
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#11 Post by Mad Harlequin » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:44 pm

fleet wrote:Do: Use a speller and grammar checker on dialog.
Adding to this. Don't rely solely on a spelling/grammar checker to check your work. It'll be useful for catching most typos, but that's about it. There are tons of things that it will miss, and it won't teach you how to improve your ability to construct fluid, expressive prose.

Off-topic: haven't we had a few topics similar to this one? Should we redirect discussion to an older thread?
Last edited by Mad Harlequin on Tue Jun 30, 2015 2:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
I'm an aspiring writer and voice talent with a passion for literature and an unhealthy attachment to video games. I am also a seasoned typo-sniper. Inquiries are encouraged. Friendly chats are welcome.
"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."
— Mark Twain

User avatar
YossarianIII
Veteran
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:26 pm
Completed: Guns & Lovers; SRRT!; Kill Your Refrigerator; Banality Man; Beretta Mondatta
Projects: Brooklyn Idol
Organization: KONOL Games
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#12 Post by YossarianIII » Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:10 pm

SundownKid wrote:Do: Reserve a lot of time and/or money for marketing
Don't: Soft launch a game with barely any fanfare (kinda defeats the point of making one)

Do: Write a full outline before you start writing
Don't: Just wing it.
I would actually disagree with all of these -- at least as universal writing advice. (They're certainly good advice for specific conditions, though.)

Even if your goal is to make commercial VNs, it might make more sense to focus on the fundamentals of writing, art, and programming before you worry about marketing -- if only because it's easier to sell a good product than a bad one. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with soft launching early games before moving on to bigger projects that you want to launch with more fanfare.

And that's all assuming you're in it to make money. I see lots of games on these forums that were clearly just made for fun or even experimental games that were made for some artistic goal -- and that's great! For those types of writers, marketing would be a low priority, if it's one at all. But if you do plan on going all-out on marketing, then SundownKid is absolutely right about making sure to budget enough time/money.

As far as outlining, it seems to be a necessary step for most good writers, but I don't see anything wrong with "winging it" for a little bit to get a feel for a story before nailing down the structure, and then revising as needed. Structure in the final story is important -- but finding your best method for achieving it might take some trial and error.

TL;DR:

Do: Practice.
Don't: Quit.


Image Image Image

User avatar
mitoky
Veteran
Posts: 316
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2015 9:12 pm
Projects: The Purring Demon's Love, circus eterie
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#13 Post by mitoky » Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:29 pm

Do: Take time for a plot/scene which seems important
Do: Check if the game has a good pace.
Don't: Rush it
Don't: Make a game based on what others want.

Of course time may be a problem when you have a deadline, but when there is time i would prefer people to take it.
Also, i dont like it when the pace/ changes in a game arent smooth. Thats why whenever you have someone to test your game its always good to have them check on the changes.

Example, that scene changes to fast, that is distracting, that scene is too quiet.
I think its important to stay captivated by the game and having others test it that way can show you what needs more atmosphere.

User avatar
Razz
Veteran
Posts: 349
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:15 pm
Completed: Starlight Vega, Catch Canvas, Love Ribbon, Happy Campers, Wolf Tails
Projects: Two projects
Organization: Razzartvisual
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#14 Post by Razz » Sun Jun 28, 2015 10:51 pm

Going off the last three demo's I've play-tested...

Do: Put in an obvious auto button

Don't: Leave it out because reasons
Image

User avatar
CSV
Regular
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:58 pm
Tumblr: csvidaldraws
Deviantart: csvidal
itch: csvidal
Location: Portugal
Contact:

Re: What are some Do's or Don'ts in your opinion?

#15 Post by CSV » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:12 pm

I'll start with general advice. So...

Do: Know your genre. Even if you are going to put a twist on it, check to see what has been done before.
Do: Check all written text for grammatical errors and the like. Even if you writing style isn't the most amazing or unique, it should be free of that sort of mistakes.
Do: Create original/different characters. I am not saying the usual stereotypes have to be left out, but it's frustrating when what you like is in no game at all because the same character-types are being repeated in every one of them.

Don't: Make the story move too slowly (so as not to be boring), nor too fast (which can become awkward).
Don't: Have mismatched art and writing. For example, maybe cutesy art isn't the best for a thriller-themed visual novel.
Don't: Create mandatory mini-games, or endings that can only be achieved through mini-games, since not everyone likes them. UNLESS it is visual novel based mostly around said mini-games, of course.



As for more personal advice...well, the problem is that it is always personal, as it has been stated before. I might love something that a lot of people hate, or vice-versa. You are probably better off doing something you will like yourself; it's more than likely that there's someone that will like the same. It's a matter of finding your "market".
☆☆☆
(portfolio)
☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users