Preference in Choices

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DVXRedstar
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Preference in Choices

#1 Post by DVXRedstar »

So I was mulling this over a bit today: what type of choices do you guys prefer in visual novels? These choices, in particular, would be the choices that will have an effect later on.

Do you rather choices that are very clear cut and you will know exactly what to expect of them later on or would you rather those inconspicuous choices that you have no idea what way they'll effect the novel later on?

Now, I know these can both be important to a visual novel's story but I guess what I'm asking is what is more enjoyable for you all to see the outcome of? As in, do you enjoy picking a choice and knowing what's to come of it or do you enjoy having to think about a choice and what the consequences of it could have in the future?

Sorry if my wording is a bit off there, I'm just curious to see what you guys think.

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Re: Preference in Choices

#2 Post by Donmai »

A discussion you may find interesting: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... f=4&t=8867
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Re: Preference in Choices

#3 Post by HiddenCreature »

I believe a balance of the two is necessary in a story that relies on choices. As for what's more interesting, it would be choices where the results aren't immediately apparent.

If I don't have to stop and think about my decisions like I would in real life, then it's less of a story, and more of me trying to manipulate events to get an ideal ending.

Some choices are pretty obvious in how they'll results. Such examples that are typically found in games are as follows:

Fight the criminals
Run away


Agree with the argument
Say nothing


Save this person
Save the other person instead


These choices, while serving an important role, should be approached like fine wine: the more of it you have, the less you'll want later.

Subtler, more thought-provoking choices have the advantage in being more numerous than their obvious counterparts, without feeling overwhelming. They also do a great job at employing something I learned from writing regular novels, which is nicknamed a "callback." Essentially, any event to refers to a previous (but not obviously significant at the time) event.

Ex: you're in a sword fight and are losing. You remember a friend telling you about design flaws in certain types of armor. At the time, you couldn't make use of that information, or it wasn't immediately useful. Now you see your enemy is wearing that same armor, and you know the weak point to exploit, thus, winning.

Callbacks, or subtler choices, are very gratifying because they acknowledge the reader's personal investment in the story. It says, "Yes, you were paying attention during this event, just like our main character was. And now that you've come this far, here's how it can help." Because if you weren't invested, you'd be scratching your head at subsequent events, right?

So to summarize, do I prefer "clear cut" as you called them, choices? Yes, but sparingly. No more than a handful, unless the game is very long. But to clarify, only in extreme situations, like choose faction 1 or faction 2. Sometimes, you need clear choices like take path A or path B.

But ultimately, my real preference is for the subtler choices, that make you think and require a slight bit more investment in the story.

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Re: Preference in Choices

#4 Post by DVXRedstar »

Donmai wrote:A discussion you may find interesting: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... f=4&t=8867
Thanks for the link, there were a lot of great responses there.

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Re: Preference in Choices

#5 Post by DVXRedstar »

HiddenCreature wrote:I believe a balance of the two is necessary in a story that relies on choices. As for what's more interesting, it would be choices where the results aren't immediately apparent.

If I don't have to stop and think about my decisions like I would in real life, then it's less of a story, and more of me trying to manipulate events to get an ideal ending.

Some choices are pretty obvious in how they'll results. Such examples that are typically found in games are as follows:

Fight the criminals
Run away


Agree with the argument
Say nothing


Save this person
Save the other person instead


These choices, while serving an important role, should be approached like fine wine: the more of it you have, the less you'll want later.

Subtler, more thought-provoking choices have the advantage in being more numerous than their obvious counterparts, without feeling overwhelming. They also do a great job at employing something I learned from writing regular novels, which is nicknamed a "callback." Essentially, any event to refers to a previous (but not obviously significant at the time) event.

Ex: you're in a sword fight and are losing. You remember a friend telling you about design flaws in certain types of armor. At the time, you couldn't make use of that information, or it wasn't immediately useful. Now you see your enemy is wearing that same armor, and you know the weak point to exploit, thus, winning.

Callbacks, or subtler choices, are very gratifying because they acknowledge the reader's personal investment in the story. It says, "Yes, you were paying attention during this event, just like our main character was. And now that you've come this far, here's how it can help." Because if you weren't invested, you'd be scratching your head at subsequent events, right?

So to summarize, do I prefer "clear cut" as you called them, choices? Yes, but sparingly. No more than a handful, unless the game is very long. But to clarify, only in extreme situations, like choose faction 1 or faction 2. Sometimes, you need clear choices like take path A or path B.

But ultimately, my real preference is for the subtler choices, that make you think and require a slight bit more investment in the story.
Thanks for the response! I just wanted to poke around a bit to find out what people would prefer in the line of choices for visual novels as I am in the process of one right now.

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Re: Preference in Choices

#6 Post by RotGtIE »

The way I see it, we all know we are not so much playing games as we are reading "choose your own adventure" stories. To that effect, I prefer when VNs use decision points to allow the player to say "this is the kind of story I want to see," not "this is the kind of decision I would make" or "I think this is the correct choice."

Saya no Uta is by far the best example of this. There are two decision points in the whole game, and three endings. Each decision point shows you neither a good nor a bad ending, but rather the possible outcomes after pivotal decision points for the characters involved. The audience is not at any point encouraged to feel as though they are self-inserting for any character, yet the audience makes decisions for those characters - two different ones, in fact, and both characters for whom the audience can make a decision are directly opposed to each other in their agendas. Not only this, but the reader is expected to have enough intelligence to understand which decisions will lead to which kinds of results for the characters involved. The reader can deliberately choose to make a decision which would be completely boneheaded for the character in question to make, especially when placed next to the much more intelligent decision found onscreen simultaneously with it. The reader knows that making this bonehead decision will probably get that character killed, but mystery or survival are not the reasons for making decisions - the viewing of a spectacle is.

I thoroughly enjoy decision points which lead to story routes that are not intended to be considered as good or bad, win or lose, success or failure, but rather which promise to tell a story within the same setting and using the same characters that is worth reading, but includes elements which make it mutually exclusive in the telling from another path the story could take which is also worth telling. Perhaps unsurprisingly, this draws me toward kinetics, and VNs with very few decision points which each lead to lengthy and worthwhile stories.

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Re: Preference in Choices

#7 Post by TrickWithAKnife »

Personally I like each choice to be a concise and fairly accurate description of what the protagonist will say or do.

If the player says or does something that I didn't intend, the feeling of agency is torn from my grasp, leaving me jaded and less likely to care about future choices.

Every single choice in a game should matter.

Every choice should be something that the protagonist would actually say or do. There's a reason why we use the phrase "out of character" when behaviour doesn't make sense.

Every choice should matter to the player, making them have to think carefully about their choices and leaving them wondering what might have happened if they had selected differently.
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