Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Kickstarter] [DEMO!]

A place for game announcements, and for people to discuss games being made.
Forum rules
Please read the sticky before creating a new topic. Linking to Kickstarter/Crowdfunded games requires a demo. Updates to Patreon-backed games may be posted once every 2 months. Adult content should not be posted in this forum.
Message
Author
User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Kickstarter] [DEMO!]

#1 Post by num »

Genre: Raising Sim, Adventure, SLG
Themes: Drama, Sci-Fi
Platform : Windows, Mac, Linux
Release date: TBD (approx. late 2017/early 2018)
[/center]
Image
KICKSTARTER IS NOW LIVE!
DEMO IS AVAILABLE!

ITCH.IO | GAMEJOLT | STEAM



Image

Image

Ciel Fledge is a game about raising your (adopted) daughter in a dying world. Taking heavy
influence from title such as Princess Maker, Idolm@ster, and Monster rancher. You are
responsible for raising her over the span of 10 years. What she becomes entirely depends
on how you raise and guide her. Will she be humanities savior? The villain that ends humanity?
Perhaps it would be better for her to lead a normal life, oblivious of the dire situation the world is in...


Image

Image

The story of Ciel Fledge takes place in the far future, where mankind's progress has stalled, and
the planet is decaying after Unknown Creatures from the earth's core attacked the surface. Mankind's
remaining few built and took refuge on a floating island called The Ark. There are 7 Arks spread
all over the world, each with their own self defense force against the mysterious Unknown Creatures
from the earth's depths. Over time, prolonged war began to leave the arks isolated. With communication
lines broken from relentless attacks by the unknown creatures, 2 Arks were considered missing and one
Ark was completely destroyed. There are now only 4 Arks remaining, and they are mankind's only lifeline...

Image

There are about 12-13 NPC characters that will grow with Ciel. Their fate in the future is intertwined with
Ciel and by extension, the way you raise and guide her throughout the 10 year span.
Image
Ciel
Your (adopted) daughter, Ciel, is one of the lucky survivors of Ark 5, the destroyed ark. She and many other
survivors were under the care of citizens in your ark, Ark 3. With limited space available, the administrators
of the ark decided she would live with you and be under your care until she grew into an adult.
Despite what happened to her, she always maintains an optimistic outlook on life.

Image
Zahra
A member of the Ark Administration and a general science teacher. Zahra is lighthearted,
somewhat clumsy, and is popular among the students and teachers alike.

Image
Erkin
An aspiring engineer who enlisted as a pilot after the death of his family from the Unknown Creature attack.
He is a cold and calculating man, but inside, he has a very gentle nature.

Image
Ivory
A very popular personality in the ark limited popular entertainment circle. Often participating in both art
and musical performances, Ivory is known for his beauty and elegance, which often confuses people into
thinking he is female. When confronted about his actual gender, he tends to dismiss it immediately,
prefering to remain ambiguous.

Image
Amira
Captain of Ark 3's self defense force. Not much is known of her since she is very quiet and rarely shows emotion.
A typical iron lady figure who needs to put up a strong and steadfast appearance in front of the masses. She secretly
likes classical music and plays the violin.

Image
Juno
A big guy who was a Veteran of the ark infantry squad, he lost his right leg in battle and had to retire early.
Nowadays, he manages a small, bustling eatery at the ark market district. It is unclear whether people visit
his eatery because of the food or because of his kind and cheerful demeanor.

Image
Helen
Typical nerdy high school student who is always seen with a guitar case. People often assume "the guitar"
Is her way of over compensating her nerdiness. Little do they know that she is actually a very skilled guitar
player who listens to the heaviest death metal music there is.

Image
  • Your daughter will grow over time depending on how you raise her (being taller, shorter, more muscular, etc.)
  • Procedural interaction between parent and child
  • Stats raising game!
  • Multiple, branching route and endings depending on your playstyle
  • Full equipment (clothing) customization
  • Real time action - puzzle battle system
Image

Screenshots mostly showcasing the gameplay of the game:

Image Image Image

Image Image Image

The screenshots in action can be seen here: https://imgur.com/a/a1UAl

Image

We are Studio Namaapa a very tiny gamedev team from Indonesia,
so forgive our bad english and grammar if you notice it on my writing :-[. Ciel Fledge is our second game in development,
its music and sound composition will be handled by M4uesviecr.

The game is currently still in development. You can follow us on our social media to get in touch and follow the development.

Facebook | Twitter | Tumblr| Indiedb | Instagram

We will also post any updates about the game here regularly, and of course a demo as soon as it is available!

Image

If you have reached this section, I assume that you have finished reading all of the above description from us, so thank you very much!
Following the usual norm of this forum, I hope you don't mind if we ask some questions so we can develop the game better:

1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
3. (Optional question) What is your initial thought of the story and characters so far?

Also please don't hesitate to give us honest critique and feedback or ask anything about the game!

Thank you again for your time!
Last edited by num on Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:45 pm, edited 9 times in total.

gekiganwing
Lemma-Class Veteran
Posts: 2473
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi] [Drama]

#2 Post by gekiganwing »

num wrote:1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
I'm interested. You see, I've been active in general video game fandom for years. While I have enjoyed games with no story, as well as VNs with no gameplay, I tend to prefer products somewhere in the middle. In other words, a combination of storytelling and interaction. This is one reason why I played the unfinished English beta of Princess Maker 2 during the 2000s, and why I played the mostly-complete fan translation of Idolmaster SP: Perfect Sun a few years ago.
num wrote:2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
Yes. I tend to avoid pop culture media which focuses on bleakness, heavy themes, and horror. At the same time, I have been critical of comedies which don't have much substance. I've disliked some light hearted stories that only seemed to include gag humor and shout-outs.
num wrote:We are Studio Namaapa, a very tiny gamedev team from Indonesia...
Your visual novel will take place in space arks in a speculative fiction world. That said... consider if you can use your VN to convey insights about your nation, beliefs, concerns, and so on. Strive to make it personal. Provide the reader with messages which are appropriate for your story.

User avatar
parttimestorier
Veteran
Posts: 429
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:29 pm
Completed: No Other Medicine, Well Met By Moonlight, RE:BURN, The Light at the End of the Ocean, Take A Hike!, Wizard School Woes
Projects: Seeds of Dreams
itch: janetitor
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi] [Drama]

#3 Post by parttimestorier »

This sounds like something I might really like! I'm definitely a fan of VN-type games that incorporate elements like stat-raising, as long as they do it well. I have played some games where I was frustrated because I felt like I was just clicking a button until a number got high enough to progress the story for no real reason. But as long as there's a purpose to the stat-raising, and going with different stats affects the story in logical ways, then I really enjoy it. (One of my favourite examples of good stat-raising is Long Live the Queen, if you haven't played it and are looking for more inspiration!)

I agree that a mix of dark and light elements in a story can work really well as well. And I think I'd be interested in trying to figure out what Amira is really like behind that "strong and steadfast appearance"!

I'm wondering, how much will the art for Ciel change as her stats do, and as she gets older? And will the art for any of the other characters change as they age? I really like it when characters' appearances reflect their development and the time that's passed in the story.

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi] [Drama]

#4 Post by num »

gekiganwing wrote:
num wrote:1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
I'm interested. You see, I've been active in general video game fandom for years. While I have enjoyed games with no story, as well as VNs with no gameplay, I tend to prefer products somewhere in the middle. In other words, a combination of storytelling and interaction. This is one reason why I played the unfinished English beta of Princess Maker 2 during the 2000s, and why I played the mostly-complete fan translation of Idolmaster SP: Perfect Sun a few years ago.
num wrote:2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
Yes. I tend to avoid pop culture media which focuses on bleakness, heavy themes, and horror. At the same time, I have been critical of comedies which don't have much substance. I've disliked some light hearted stories that only seemed to include gag humor and shout-outs.
num wrote:We are Studio Namaapa, a very tiny gamedev team from Indonesia...
Your visual novel will take place in space arks in a speculative fiction world. That said... consider if you can use your VN to convey insights about your nation, beliefs, concerns, and so on. Strive to make it personal. Provide the reader with messages which are appropriate for your story.
Thank you for the feedbacks! While it is difficult to have a really original story that avoid typical stereotype and tropes, we will try to at least come up with something really personal and conveying insights from our point of view.
parttimestorier wrote:This sounds like something I might really like! I'm definitely a fan of VN-type games that incorporate elements like stat-raising, as long as they do it well. I have played some games where I was frustrated because I felt like I was just clicking a button until a number got high enough to progress the story for no real reason. But as long as there's a purpose to the stat-raising, and going with different stats affects the story in logical ways, then I really enjoy it. (One of my favourite examples of good stat-raising is Long Live the Queen, if you haven't played it and are looking for more inspiration!)

I agree that a mix of dark and light elements in a story can work really well as well. And I think I'd be interested in trying to figure out what Amira is really like behind that "strong and steadfast appearance"!

I'm wondering, how much will the art for Ciel change as her stats do, and as she gets older? And will the art for any of the other characters change as they age? I really like it when characters' appearances reflect their development and the time that's passed in the story.
Thanks! Actually I have a bit of difficulties on giving description to the characters and worried that it may spoiler their story. I'm glad that you find Amira interesting enough to figure out!

Regarding Ciel's art, yes! She will change over the time. She will also change to be more taller, thinner or even fatter depending on how you raise her. You will also get the option to change her hairstyle in the salon. Also, other characters will change appearance too! At the moment we don't have any art sample to show Ciel's and other characters art transformation since we are still working on the basic gameplay (and other stuff) but I will make sure to show some of them here in future update!

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi] [Drama]

#5 Post by num »

Time for some update!

Last week we are working on the visual and design of the shop to buy/sell items and equipments.

The first iteration of the design looks like this:

Image

But I'm not quite satisfied with so many color clashing especially with the icons seems to blend with the background and is not easy to differentiate. After a few revisions ahead we come up with this design, which look more clear and distinct:

Image

Image

Basically the idea is, aside of the usual of buying selling items, you can also visit the place, interact with the owner of the place, the people, or bumping with another NPCs who is shopping there too. Depending on Ciel's CHA and related skills, she may also haggle and getting cheaper price, that's what the haggle button is for!


Here's the "shopping" in action:

Image

Midnight shopping with Ciel:

Image

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi] [Drama]

#6 Post by num »

There is no pretty pic to show off yet, but we do are working hard to set up the core gameplay first. Also I think we are going to scratch off the [Drama] tag since I realized the game is not "dramatic" in any way. Actually speaking gameplay-wise, we are leaning to reach roguelike territory aside of the core raising sims gameplay with the introduction of exploration mode. Which will be probably explained in the next update or devlogs.

So today update is the usual devlog we posted bi-monthly detailing our progress, if you prefer to read the original article you can do so at our website here!

[Ciel Devlog #04] Building Shop Menu and Interfaces

For the last two weeks we are working to build shop menu where you can buy/sell items and equipments. It's nothing fancy but we are trying to make it as simple and intuitive as possible. Basically before you go "shopping" you pretty much have to schedule your daughter to do it in advance from the schedule menu (which is pretty much the most important menu of the game where your decision is made there).

Image

After that, in the automated turn, you will be presented with another interface where you can select which shop your daughter will visit and what item do you want her to buy. Pretty simple really. Aside from the simple usual shopping system, we decided to add "haggle" mechanics. Taking advantage of your daughter stats that you can train such as 'Charm, Charisma, and Math' she can haggle the price of any items/equipments and make it cheaper for her.

Another aspect from the shop menu we want to implement is item/equipment stocks. Each shop will have limited stocks of everything depending on their rarity and value, some items are abundant while the others might be scarce. At the moment this is still work in progress, but I think you got the general idea of this supply/demand system.

Here's the animated gifs of shopping in action! (also in previous post):

Image

Image

Redoing and polishing the interface (yet) again

One of the biggest gripe of this game for me is to come up with the interface that is simple enough that even a 5-years old can understand instantly and intuitively without any guide or dragging tutorial. Considering the actual complexity of the game (despite of its cutesy appearance) and the need of so many interface and visual cues it's proven to be really hard to do.

The schedule menu interface is the biggest offender of the "too complex interface" so far. Currently it looks like this:

Image

In this menu you need to select player activity, weekly meal plan, and 7 days of your daughter activity. All lined up at the list on the right side, while the wide, window selection at the left is the available choice corresponding to what you are currently selecting and set up in the list at the right side. The colorful button at the top of the left side is the sort/filter button, to sort the selection based on its categories. Pretty confusing right? Especially considering the overload of information with so many descriptions and buttons at once on screen. This is the second iteration of the schedule menu revamp, it used to looks like this before:

Image

Even more confusing right?

Anyhow this will be a tough homework for me. Hopefully I can come up with better design that is nice to look at and easily understandable at a glance.

Next is the slight change on the interface such as icons, buttons, and windows. At the beginning of the development, I actually fell for the Flat UI meme only to realize it looks horrible with the artstyle we are going with, and is too unsophisticated. So I decide to change it slightly and give it more character and depth with emboss and outline effects:

Old UI set
Image

New UI set
Image

Now at least the interface is not as bland as the top flat UI anymore. Although the interface style might change again since these are all still quite early- actually middle way in development.

Well, I think that is all from me. Hopefully this devlog could inspire you, see you on our next Ciel devlog! You can also visit our tumblr for more Ciel Fledge because I sometimes draw Ciel art if I'm not lazy busy with developing the game! :mrgreen:

User avatar
LizardRobot
Regular
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:39 pm
Projects: A Town Called Shanty
Organization: Lizard Robot
Deviantart: lizrobot
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#7 Post by LizardRobot »

1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
Totally down for it! I played Princess Maker back in the day and really enjoyed it. I'm down for a modern version with a little less perviness!

2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
I suppose it depends on the mature themes in question? The character does have an innocent look to her and starts the game as a child... I'm totally cool with exploring themes that are potentially dark or moody or world-shattering, but not so much themes that would involve bad adult things happening to my daughter. That's not what youre planning'I don't think, but "mature themes and content" can refer to a lot of stuff!

3. (Optional question) What is your initial thought of the story and characters so far?
I really like the scifi setting, the backstory behind adopting Ciel, and the cast looks great! I especially like Erkin, and Amira seems cool.

Overall I'd say this is a project I'd really be interested in, because of the Princess Maker resemblance! I like nostalgia in my gaming. (I played PM for so many hours in middle/high school.)

User avatar
pavellumpendulum
Newbie
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 8:25 pm
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#8 Post by pavellumpendulum »

Okay, as someone who loved Princess Maker, I was super excited to see this project. All the previews you've shown look so well put together!

1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
I think it's great! I love visual novels with some gameplay in them even if it's just something small because it kind of takes away from spending all your time just cycling through dialogue. Though there's nothing wrong with that, I do think some more interaction can't hurt.

2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
Definitely. If the content is superficial and typical, then I feel like it would be harder to get attached to Ciel. Maybe that's just me though.

3. What is your initial thought of the story and characters so far?
The setting really makes me think of The 100 (which I really liked the concept of, so it's a plus in my eyes). So far, I think Juno looks the most interesting as a character.

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#9 Post by num »

LizardRobot wrote:1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
Totally down for it! I played Princess Maker back in the day and really enjoyed it. I'm down for a modern version with a little less perviness!

2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
I suppose it depends on the mature themes in question? The character does have an innocent look to her and starts the game as a child... I'm totally cool with exploring themes that are potentially dark or moody or world-shattering, but not so much themes that would involve bad adult things happening to my daughter. That's not what youre planning'I don't think, but "mature themes and content" can refer to a lot of stuff!

3. (Optional question) What is your initial thought of the story and characters so far?
I really like the scifi setting, the backstory behind adopting Ciel, and the cast looks great! I especially like Erkin, and Amira seems cool.

Overall I'd say this is a project I'd really be interested in, because of the Princess Maker resemblance! I like nostalgia in my gaming. (I played PM for so many hours in middle/high school.)
Thank you for the feedback! I do played a lot of PM back then especially PM2, in fact, the lack of PM-like games makes me itching to just make another one! :D
pavellumpendulum wrote:Okay, as someone who loved Princess Maker, I was super excited to see this project. All the previews you've shown look so well put together!

1. What do you think about the gameplay section of the game which is expected to be a lot more than the usual VN content?
I think it's great! I love visual novels with some gameplay in them even if it's just something small because it kind of takes away from spending all your time just cycling through dialogue. Though there's nothing wrong with that, I do think some more interaction can't hurt.

2. Are you okay if the game incorporate more mature themes and content despite its light hearted undertone?
Definitely. If the content is superficial and typical, then I feel like it would be harder to get attached to Ciel. Maybe that's just me though.

3. What is your initial thought of the story and characters so far?
The setting really makes me think of The 100 (which I really liked the concept of, so it's a plus in my eyes). So far, I think Juno looks the most interesting as a character.
Thanks for the feedback! I need to look for The 100 for more references haha!


Also here's some small update for this week:

There are actually 13 NPCs so not all of them is showcased in the OP. This is another NPC characters who will also grow up with Ciel (aka childhood friend), Vivi.

Vivi in dialogue system. All NPCs and Ciel will have this sort of simple animation to make them more lively! (*cough* too poor to afford Live2D *cough*)
Image

Vivi design sheet and her various body expression:
Image

For more detailed pics and explanation you can see it here!

User avatar
LizardRobot
Regular
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:39 pm
Projects: A Town Called Shanty
Organization: Lizard Robot
Deviantart: lizrobot
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#10 Post by LizardRobot »

I think Live2d free version is allowed for use by indie devs, and the PRO license has a lower price for indie devs as well! It's actually why I'm thinking of giving it a try myself down the line. (Gotta finish all the designs and game framework first, though.) But the animation looks very nice! Vivi's very cute, I like her character design.

I think it will be a lot of fun to watch the whole cast age up alongside the daughter. ^^

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#11 Post by num »

LizardRobot wrote:I think Live2d free version is allowed for use by indie devs, and the PRO license has a lower price for indie devs as well! It's actually why I'm thinking of giving it a try myself down the line. (Gotta finish all the designs and game framework first, though.) But the animation looks very nice! Vivi's very cute, I like her character design.

I think it will be a lot of fun to watch the whole cast age up alongside the daughter. ^^
Thanks! Yeah it's also really fun drawing their grown up version (also with slight branching on their appearance depending on the story route and your decision). Regarding the Live2D unfortunately it's already too late for us since we basically need to redo everything if we decide to use it haha. A bit out of topic, I'd definitely recommend you to use it in your VN project though (peeking on the thread thanks to your signature!) especially if it's still really early in development, unlike ours who already pass early development and is now in the middle.

--------
Anyway, time for some update! This week is devlog time and it's time for devlog #05. In this devlog we are talking about Ciel Fledge music inspiration and its composition process but since it will be too long if I post the entire devlog here I think it will be wise if I just give the link to it below for those who are interested:

Image
[Ciel Devlog #05] The Music of Ciel

Also here's the audio snippet of the track WIP on Soundcloud. We are currently making player character creation music!

Image
Ciel Fledge Character Creation Music WIP

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#12 Post by num »

Update for this week, still related with previous character gestures update, here it is in action:

Image

The message box is intentionally like that because, well, I don't want the player to get fixated on the text and ignoring the characters portrait and their gesture in the dialogue. Too often if the messagebox is using the usual convention, placed at the bottom of the screen, with the text and sentences smothered lengthily in a wide message box, the player will lose focus on the entire screen, ignoring the art and portrait, because they have to read that text positioned in the bottom. The comic-style text bubble is our solution to that! conveniently located near the center of the screen, shorter sentences, and more emphasis on the characters gesture and portrait.

That's it for this week ciel mini-update, if you want to read and see the lineart of characters in the gif above, you can visit our tumblr page here: http://cielfledge.tumblr.com/post/15930 ... d-gestures

See you in the next (mini) update!

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#13 Post by num »

Devlog for this week is out, it's mainly about system improvement and no eye candy (except our programmer art!) but if you are interested you can read it here!

In the meantime we are currently polishing the schedule menu so it will be more intuitive and easier to read:

Image

Also implementing the new dynamic camera movement on the home screen, so the game feel less static and more dynamic!

Image

That is all see you in the next update! A bit unrelated but for the sake of cuteness here is our new studio mascot:

Image

If you want to see more of her, you can see it in our instagram!

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#14 Post by num »

Time for mini-update this week! Here are some of the things we are working with this game till this post!

Last week we implemented dynamic camera movement on the home screen. The new camera movement proved to be too much fun and we are still having fun (read: tweaking) with it so it's not becoming too nauseating.

Image

Polishing and cleaning up ciel status menu where you can inspect her status, skills, and traits. You can see her main stats clearly now with addition of icons, also more information about her such as height, weight, and most importantly condition (she can get sick, depressed, hyped depending on the situation).

Image

Lastly, we have also been cleaning up the schedule menu. This is the third major overhaul on the schedule menu, and I think we have if not already, completed our objective to make the menu less clustered, easy to read and intuitive enough!

Image

With all the major interface and UI groundwork almost done, we are getting closer and closer to finish the basic gameplay loop and to actually having a playable and enjoyable demo! So stay tune and see you in our next progress update! Don't forget to also follow us on facebook and twitter for more update on Ciel Fledge!

User avatar
num
Regular
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:38 am
Contact:

Re: Ciel Fledge [Raising Sim] [Sci-Fi]

#15 Post by num »

No more lengthy text post since today update is the preview of battle mode we have been polished the last few weeks! But if you do want to read about the latest development there is a devlog #7 at our blog website.

If you noticed, the battle interface from the OP is quite different from the newest improvement since we are overhauling them a bit. More detail about the battle mode will come but for now please enjoy the gif animations! :D

Image

Image

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users