Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
- cesullivan
- Regular
- Posts: 42
- Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 5:14 pm
- Completed: Story of Dream Infinite (Open Beta)
- Projects: Story of Dream Infinite
- Organization: C.E. Sullivan Games
- Location: North Texas, United States
- Contact:
Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
This may be a really weird place to ask this, but...
They come in apple, pear, and banana flavors.
They come in apple, pear and banana flavors.
The comma that I dropped in the second sentence is known as the Oxford or serial comma. When I was in middle/high school I was taught to drop the Oxford comma, but now most U.S. English style guides say to use it. Often, I find myself using it because it seems less controversial than not using it, but I don't really like it. I think it usually disrupts the flow of the sentence, and most of the time it doesn't clear up any ambiguities, which is supposed to be the purpose of having it.
Anyone else have any special feelings towards the Oxford comma? What were you guys taught in school?
They come in apple, pear, and banana flavors.
They come in apple, pear and banana flavors.
The comma that I dropped in the second sentence is known as the Oxford or serial comma. When I was in middle/high school I was taught to drop the Oxford comma, but now most U.S. English style guides say to use it. Often, I find myself using it because it seems less controversial than not using it, but I don't really like it. I think it usually disrupts the flow of the sentence, and most of the time it doesn't clear up any ambiguities, which is supposed to be the purpose of having it.
Anyone else have any special feelings towards the Oxford comma? What were you guys taught in school?
"Awake Ublasti, foxy fire goddess...forget love, let's play a Combustion game!"
Story of Dream Infinite dev blog@ http://www.storyofdreaminfinite.wordpress.com | Works in Progress Thread Here
Download Open Beta Version Now at cesullivangames.com/sodi
Story of Dream Infinite dev blog@ http://www.storyofdreaminfinite.wordpress.com | Works in Progress Thread Here
Download Open Beta Version Now at cesullivangames.com/sodi
- trooper6
- Lemma-Class Veteran
- Posts: 3712
- Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:33 pm
- Projects: A Close Shave
- Location: Medford, MA
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
I always use the Oxford comma--because there are cases where things can get confusing if you don't and I think it is important to be consistent.
The two classic examples of where you need the Oxford comma:
*I’d like to thank my parents, Ayn Rand and God.
*We invited the strippers, JFK and Stalin.
The two classic examples of where you need the Oxford comma:
*I’d like to thank my parents, Ayn Rand and God.
*We invited the strippers, JFK and Stalin.
A Close Shave:
*Last Thing Done (Aug 17): Finished coding emotions and camera for 4/10 main labels.
*Currently Doing: Coding of emotions and camera for the labels--On 5/10
*First Next thing to do: Code in all CG and special animation stuff
*Next Next thing to do: Set up film animation
*Other Thing to Do: Do SFX and Score (maybe think about eye blinks?) Check out My Clock Cookbook Recipe: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 51&t=21978
*Last Thing Done (Aug 17): Finished coding emotions and camera for 4/10 main labels.
*Currently Doing: Coding of emotions and camera for the labels--On 5/10
*First Next thing to do: Code in all CG and special animation stuff
*Next Next thing to do: Set up film animation
*Other Thing to Do: Do SFX and Score (maybe think about eye blinks?) Check out My Clock Cookbook Recipe: http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 51&t=21978
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Who gives a f*ck about an Oxford comma?
But seriously, sometimes the Oxford comma is very useful, the following picture demonstrates that.
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lroov ... o1_500.jpg
Most of the time it is redundant though.
But seriously, sometimes the Oxford comma is very useful, the following picture demonstrates that.
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lroov ... o1_500.jpg
Most of the time it is redundant though.
- cesullivan
- Regular
- Posts: 42
- Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 5:14 pm
- Completed: Story of Dream Infinite (Open Beta)
- Projects: Story of Dream Infinite
- Organization: C.E. Sullivan Games
- Location: North Texas, United States
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Yeah, I know, I'm totally OCD.Kjata wrote:Who gives a f*ck about an Oxford comma?
I totally just made that my desktop wallpaper.Kjata wrote:But seriously, sometimes the Oxford comma is very useful, the following picture demonstrates that.
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lroov ... o1_500.jpg
"Awake Ublasti, foxy fire goddess...forget love, let's play a Combustion game!"
Story of Dream Infinite dev blog@ http://www.storyofdreaminfinite.wordpress.com | Works in Progress Thread Here
Download Open Beta Version Now at cesullivangames.com/sodi
Story of Dream Infinite dev blog@ http://www.storyofdreaminfinite.wordpress.com | Works in Progress Thread Here
Download Open Beta Version Now at cesullivangames.com/sodi
-
- King of Lolies
- Posts: 4538
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 9:57 pm
- Completed: R.S.P
- Location: Bandung, West Java, Indonesia
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
I always taught to use comma like OP first example (Indonesian, my native language). But when I first taught English, I was taught the OP second example. I was confused at first but since it's two different language, they simply have different rules.
But now, I just use the comma like Kjata's example.
But now, I just use the comma like Kjata's example.
"Double the princesses, quadruple the fun!" - Haken Browning (SRW-OG Endless Frontier)
DeviantArt Account
MoeToMecha Blog (under construction)
Lolicondria Blog (under construction) <- NSFW
DeviantArt Account
MoeToMecha Blog (under construction)
Lolicondria Blog (under construction) <- NSFW
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
I usually see and was taught the way your first sentence has it (I am in IL, US). As you said, the second way is still correct, but not used as much. It bothers some people, but probably not most. I would pause an extra second the first time I come across it without the commas, mainly bc I'm not used to seeing it like that. So in short, I would use the first way for your writing. I am sorry it bothers you though >.<
- KomiTsuku
- Eileen-Class Veteran
- Posts: 1023
- Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2008 11:32 pm
- Completed: Dreams of the Skies, Anton's Vacation, Luka, The Halberd and The Tiger, Rising Angels, Pyrite Heart, Rising Angels: Reborn, The Halberd and The Fox, VN Tycoon, RA: Hope
- Projects: Rising Angels
- Organization: IDHAS Studios
- IRC Nick: Komi
- itch: idhas
- Location: Somewhere
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Leaving it out bothers me. It just looks wrong to me without it.
My common sense is tingling!
Woah! I actually have a website now. It never updates!
Woah! I actually have a website now. It never updates!
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Just my two cents, but use them depending on whether the situation needs it or not.
The first line is clearer, it states that there are three flavours: (apple), (pear) and (banana).
However the second line is more vague, since there might only be two flavours: (apple) and (pear and banana).
If the situation doesn't call for it, eg. "I can only choose one colour; either red, blue or yellow," then I don't think there's a need for it.
Of course, most people are more comfortable with adding a comma since when you read "blue or yellow", there's no pause in your reading to indicate a new item. It seems like adding a comma slows it down and breaks it into two items, so I would personally use it.
<3
For example, I would go with the first line.cesullivan wrote:They come in apple, pear, and banana flavors.
They come in apple, pear and banana flavors.
The first line is clearer, it states that there are three flavours: (apple), (pear) and (banana).
However the second line is more vague, since there might only be two flavours: (apple) and (pear and banana).
If the situation doesn't call for it, eg. "I can only choose one colour; either red, blue or yellow," then I don't think there's a need for it.
Of course, most people are more comfortable with adding a comma since when you read "blue or yellow", there's no pause in your reading to indicate a new item. It seems like adding a comma slows it down and breaks it into two items, so I would personally use it.
<3
Hatred: the absence of love.
Please, treat me with kindness.
Please, treat me with kindness.
- OokamiKasumi
- Eileen-Class Veteran
- Posts: 1779
- Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 3:53 am
- Completed: 14 games released -- and Counting.
- Organization: DarkErotica Games
- Deviantart: OokamiKasumi
- Location: NC, USA
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
I write professionally for four different publishing houses, 3 American, and one Canadian. My editors from all four insist that I use the last comma.cesullivan wrote:This may be a really weird place to ask this, but...
They come in apple, pear, and banana flavors.
They come in apple, pear and banana flavors.
The comma that I dropped in the second sentence is known as the Oxford or serial comma. When I was in middle/high school I was taught to drop the Oxford comma, but now most U.S. English style guides say to use it...
However, your story doesn't has to face a publishing editor's red pen, so if you don't like it, don't use it.They come in apple, pear, and banana flavors.
Ookami Kasumi ~ Purveyor of fine Smut.
Most recent Games Completed:
"No amount of great animation will save a bad story." -- John Lasseter of Pixar
Most recent Games Completed:
- The Walk[Psychological][NanoWinter] ~ PG New!
- Trap! [ModernFantasy][VN] ~ PG16
- The Adventures of Prince Ivan [Fant/Adv/VN] ~ PG
"No amount of great animation will save a bad story." -- John Lasseter of Pixar
- arachni42
- Veteran
- Posts: 341
- Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:33 pm
- Organization: no, I'm pretty messy
- Location: New York
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Personally, I like using it, but whether you use it is up to you. Either way is correct, but whatever you choose, stay consistent.
Sometimes using it can remove confusion:
I’d like to thank my parents, Ayn Rand and God. [Your parents are Ayn Rand and God?]
But it can also add confusion:
I’d like to thank my mother, Ayn Rand, and God. [Your mother is Ayn Rand?]
So, whichever. You can always rewrite the sentence.
I'd like to thank God, Ayn Rand[,] and my parents.
Or, heaven forbid:
I'd like to thank Ayn Rand, the most important person in my life ever. Oh yeah, I'd also like to thank God and my parents. They're not as important in my life as Ayn Rand, but they're tied for a close second.
Here is a relevant link: http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/educat ... a-pictures
Sometimes using it can remove confusion:
I’d like to thank my parents, Ayn Rand and God. [Your parents are Ayn Rand and God?]
But it can also add confusion:
I’d like to thank my mother, Ayn Rand, and God. [Your mother is Ayn Rand?]
So, whichever. You can always rewrite the sentence.
I'd like to thank God, Ayn Rand[,] and my parents.
Or, heaven forbid:
I'd like to thank Ayn Rand, the most important person in my life ever. Oh yeah, I'd also like to thank God and my parents. They're not as important in my life as Ayn Rand, but they're tied for a close second.
Here is a relevant link: http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/educat ... a-pictures
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
What I hate about English is that there are controversies in grammar, and the lack of language regulator (because English is spoken in many countries). MLA is the closest to a language regulator. Side question: Are there any other languages with as much controversy in grammar as English? Give me a link.
I live in Canada but I choose to follow American spelling and style guides, even in my essays.
I would only use Oxford commas to avoid ambiguities.
I live in Canada but I choose to follow American spelling and style guides, even in my essays.
I would only use Oxford commas to avoid ambiguities.
- BonBocchan
- Newbie
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2013 11:23 pm
- Location: The Land Down Under
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Ah, the irregularities and inconsistencies of English...
Really, these days it's all about preference and basically what you think 'feels' right (unless as Kasumi said you're writing for a publisher that wants it a specific way; different publishing houses can have specific requirements when it comes to grammar and spelling). It's like a lot of things in English that used to be conventional, these days they're just not done as much, and so it's not quite as much of a problem when you do something differently.
I'm from Australia, and obviously we use our own form of English as opposed to British or American English, and yet quite recently English teachers have stopped marking the use of American English and whatnot as 'wrong'. It isn't wrong, but technically in Australia we shouldn't be using it.
Another example that I experienced first hand this year at college was the use of semi-colons ... Oh man, it's amazing how little people my age and younger (at least in Australia) know of grammar and the conventions of the English language. My English teacher spent a week's worth of lessons just going over basic grammar and punctuation, especially the semi-colon and how to use it properly. In the end most people didn't really understand, either from not paying attention, or maybe it wasn't explained well, but either way my class was a prime example of how English just isn't taught any more. Some people were horrendous when it came to the vocabulary activities.
There isn't even any consistency between how you're taught to write in high school/college and university here. They all want different things from you, and some are fine with certain things, and others not.
Excuse that little rant ... English classes are pet peeve of mine.
Anyway, English is a strange language, and seems to be becoming more and more flexible in what is accepted as time goes by. There aren't really any other languages quite like Englishthank God.
Really, these days it's all about preference and basically what you think 'feels' right (unless as Kasumi said you're writing for a publisher that wants it a specific way; different publishing houses can have specific requirements when it comes to grammar and spelling). It's like a lot of things in English that used to be conventional, these days they're just not done as much, and so it's not quite as much of a problem when you do something differently.
I'm from Australia, and obviously we use our own form of English as opposed to British or American English, and yet quite recently English teachers have stopped marking the use of American English and whatnot as 'wrong'. It isn't wrong, but technically in Australia we shouldn't be using it.
Another example that I experienced first hand this year at college was the use of semi-colons ... Oh man, it's amazing how little people my age and younger (at least in Australia) know of grammar and the conventions of the English language. My English teacher spent a week's worth of lessons just going over basic grammar and punctuation, especially the semi-colon and how to use it properly. In the end most people didn't really understand, either from not paying attention, or maybe it wasn't explained well, but either way my class was a prime example of how English just isn't taught any more. Some people were horrendous when it came to the vocabulary activities.
There isn't even any consistency between how you're taught to write in high school/college and university here. They all want different things from you, and some are fine with certain things, and others not.
Excuse that little rant ... English classes are pet peeve of mine.
Anyway, English is a strange language, and seems to be becoming more and more flexible in what is accepted as time goes by. There aren't really any other languages quite like English
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
I'm also rather OCD about the Oxford comma. I've never met anyone who's against using it, just those who are...sometimes too lazy to, I think
I personally think it's necessary because it really does eliminate confusion. Although, I think if you're going to list items that are together, it might be better to put that earlier in the list.
You can include the following to your sandwich!
Tomatoes, pickles, onions, salt and pepper
OR
Tomatoes, salt and pepper, pickles, and onions
Oh the English language...
I personally think it's necessary because it really does eliminate confusion. Although, I think if you're going to list items that are together, it might be better to put that earlier in the list.
You can include the following to your sandwich!
Tomatoes, pickles, onions, salt and pepper
OR
Tomatoes, salt and pepper, pickles, and onions
Oh the English language...
- KaenSe4
- Regular
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 3:51 am
- Completed: Good Morning Triss (2019), Palette Swap (Nano 16), Fairly Dangerous (Nano 15)
- itch: kaense4.itch.io
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Oxford commas are definitely the way to go, for me, at least. My high school teacher used to ridicule *heh* the lack of Oxford commas by providing examples such as the ones given by trooper6 and Kjata. I also find the commas pretty useful to clarify series of objects or descriptions.
Trust me, Oxford commas are more useful than most people think.
Trust me, Oxford commas are more useful than most people think.
- buttdumpling
- Regular
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:20 pm
- Projects: Dämmerung
- Location: USA
- Contact:
Re: Does anyone have an opinion on Oxford (serial) commas?
Honestly, since you prefer one way you should stick with it. I prefer the oxford comma, but I use commas too much, heh heh.
Either way can be confusing, so maybe just try to eliminate lists as much as possible from your writing.
Either way can be confusing, so maybe just try to eliminate lists as much as possible from your writing.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users