chocojax's Art Thread [Critique always appreciated!]

[chocojax]

Ooh, by distinguish, I just mean sometimes when you look at photos (I was talking about anatomy-wise, but yeah it spreads to everything) it's kind of hard to wrap your head on what EXACTLY you're looking at.

I saw your post on the day of and I SWEAR I saw you write something else for the last sentence, LOL. Yaaaa, I'll set it up maybe tomorrow if I have time. :P

[Ernestalice15]

I really like your art style. They are just like paintings. Your background is also stunning, and I can't really give criticism since I can't really draw backgrounds. But as far as I see, sometimes you drew your characters' body a bit smaller in proportion compared to their head. And the last girl (lolita girl), her shoulders' position is kinda weird for me.

[hiko27]

Oh... Oh, okay. I think I get what you mean. I never really had much of a problem with that, which was why I got confused right there, but hey, an obstacle to go through right? Much more fun to have obstacles on the way to improving your art than having none at all. Well, that's what I think.

Praise the edit button, lol. I wrote that I was going to just start the thread, but I'm quite bombarded with things to do atm, and wouldn't be able to look over the thread so decided against it. But if somehow you're too busy, I'm up for starting it. All for the sake of ogling muscles and drawing naked people.

[chocojax]

@Ernestalice15: Thank you!! And yeah, I have a lot of trouble with that. I'm at least noticing it a lot more now, but it's still a problem. :[

@hiko27: Oooh, I get that problem often because of the lighting and stuff. Maybe I'm blind. :v
And yeah, I think having obstacles is fun. Frustrating sometimes, but it's still great to have that feeling of "I FINALLY UNDERSTAND!" for a brief moment and then to not understand anymore. :P

Shoot, I was thinking that you edited it and the post just didn't show the standard "edited on blah date," buuut. Naah, I'm completely free right now because it's still summer! Woo!

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And to not spam my own thread with replies, here are some updates:
ordered oldest -> newest

[Didules]

As always I'm impressed by your skills!

I absolutely adore the 6th piece of art, this way of painting looks really soft, it adds a nice feeling to the whole composition!
The backgrounds are also really impressive, the way you handled the contrast and saturation to change the mood and the time of the day is really impressive! Still, if the last one is by night, I wonder if the shadow on the ground should stay this dark and contrasted? It feels a bit weird, because by night the shadow should be softer and less easy to see? Even though the changes on the contrast/saturation work great, that's something to remember

(And yeah, i won't kiss the cook but the last drawing made me laugh my heart out! )

[hiko27]

Ah, I think it helps if you actually plot things out in the picture (or for in real life objects), like when drawing a person, we use sausages and stuff. That helps you see the underlying structure, and when you study how those work in photos, you learn something new. Haha, I actually thrive on challenges, mostly because I like being challenged mentally. But yeah, it's pretty exciting when you finally get something, and it's like beating the boss in some game lol. It's very exhilirating, and then I obsess over that. Partly because I want to embed it in my brain and the other reason is because I'm so happy I can do it that I do it over and over again. Only to forget because you haven't drawn in a year orz

Same here. I was actually wondering what the heck happened so that it wasn't showing.

And sorry for redlining, I honestly feel like I shouldn't be redlining you amazing artists lol. But anyways, I'll try explaining to the best of my abilities what I did, and how I did it.

Upper left: I did a lot here. But mostly the drawing with the back on the far right. Your shoulder was too far away. Using a center line on your body not only helps remind you where the center of the body is, but also the perspective of each part of the body. Seeing as I followed the center line based on your torso, as I said, the right shoulder joint/arm was too far away. At this angle, it could barely be seen. I made it bigger here so you could see, but it should be barely peeking because of the back. Another is the left arm. If you imagine that arm straightening out, you'd notice the proportions aren't right. The lower arm is too short so there's two ways to fix this: Foreshorten the lower arm, or make it longer, which would then change the location of the wrist and hand. I did the former because I love to foreshorten things, it makes your drawing more dynamic. For the bottom middle drawing that looks like a kungfu pose, I corrected your proportion for the figure's left leg, and I also made it a little more curvy/flowy. I'll explain what I meant by this later on. As for the bottom with the pecs, I know you can barely see it because of how heavy my lines are, but the left side of the figure should be stretching while the inner, right side should be contracting in itself. I'll just link to my instructor's drawings on these, but he told us of a method where you use a bean and you squish it. You use the bean as your guide for the torso. Next is the hand on the very top. The fingers look like they're facing to the right but then there thumb is facing to the left. Idk if that makes sense, but pretty much, their perspectives are different (as well as opposites) so I fixed that. I also fixed the muscle at the bottom of the thumb, it needs to be bigger because it starts from the middle of your palm, just above where the hand and wrist are connected. If you want me to draw this out, just let me know.

Bottom left: Shoulder is too big, even for a guy (idk if a guy or a girl??????), which throws off your hand as well. The arm, just from what I can imagine based on what's on the picture, looks waaaaay too long. I suggest if you're going to draw a close-up, to plan out the torso, or at least as much as you think will provide your foundation for the anatomy. There's nothing wrong with drawing the whole torso despite cropping it closer to their face. That way, you know your proportions and anatomy are right.

Bottom right: Proportions are way off. Her legs are too short. If she's supposed to be small, you should make her torso smaller. And I didn't add them in but it's the same with the rest of your designs. It feels as if the legs are too short.

Upper right: You can see me using the bean on the girl here. Also, looking at the center line that I based off of what you draw for the torso, her right leg can't turn that much. (I actually tried it right now and that hurt) Because they're both facing to the northeast, her right leg can't do a 90 from the perspective. Idk if that makes sense, but if it's confusing, I can draw it out. Heck, if any of these are confusing, just tell me and I'll draw them out as best as I can.

Sidenote: If you want to make your character look more dynamic, or pretty much less boring, add tons of curves to their pose. Make their pose flow with curves. If you look at the center lines I drew in some of these, you could see that I never drew a straight line. Straight lines are boring, it's very predictable. Curves, they can go in any direction. I don't remember what my instructor said exactly, but he said something along those lines. If you look at Tintoretto's drawings, you'll notice he uses curves for the legs, arms and torso. This also applies to your pose as a whole. Let me use the girl that I used the bean on. If you notice, her legs sort of flow together. It curves in from the top, curves out at the joint, and then curves in, then slowly curves out until it reaches the feet. Something like that. I think this might be something that's best explained with a drawing... Again. But, if you look at some of my redlines, you can see that I try and do the flow I just mentioned. Our bodies are literally always curving, even when you're standing up. Adding curves make your drawing look more natural.

As for the rest, I'd actually like to see them refined. For the hallway background thingy, the walls on the right shouldn't have light on them (though reflective light from the floor, yes). Guessing from the way the shadows on the floor are drawn, I assume that the windows are directly across from those little niches. And from the design you drew, you have this part of the pillar that juts out. If that's the case, then those walls should barely have light on them. Unless that gradient is for wear on the walls and whatnot.

Sorry for the really long ass critique. I honestly love critiquing people because I know they can improve, but I talk way too much (I'm pretty sure you already noticed that a few replies back lol)

[chocojax]

@Didules: Aw shoot, thanks!! For both the compliment and for giving me critique. :3c
Oooh, right. I was planning on making the shadow flip to the other side to signify time change, but would the shadows even show up (because night time)? Iiii'll try to mess around with that.

(And I'm happy to hear that!! Was meant to be sillies. :D)

@hiko27: Just to say in advance, thanks for taking the time out of your day to write all of that! I won't respond to everything you've written (because I'll most likely repeat myself), but I just wanted to let you know that I read through everything and will try super hard to keep these things in mind in future drawings!!

Upper left: Can't access your instructor's drawings, qq. I think I kinda understand the bean thing, sort of like imagine the torso as a bean and then stretching/compressing it depending on how the ribcage/hips turn?
And even though it's super obvious, I never actively knew that the chunk for the thumb starts at half of the wrist. I'm fine if you don't, but any drawings would help a lot. =v=b

Bottom left: (lool she's a girrrrlll) Yeah... I uh... I was really lazy when planning it out (since I was hyperfocused on her face rather than anything else). I really do need to get into the habit of drawing past the intended view though.

Bottom right: Yeah, I have a lot of trouble with legs (always drawin' people super short). At least they're character designs so I can say fk it with them, but I'll try to fix their legs in any leg-showing pictures. qq

Upper right: Oooooh, I see! You just draw a bean for the torso (to imitate the back curve?).
And yeah, comparing the drawing I made with the actual ref, her torso's meant to be turned more to the left.
Because what's both facing northeast? The feet?

Hallway background thingy: Yeaaaahhh, I was actually trying to get away with the lighting thing on the walls HAHAHAH. It was only shaded that way to look cool (????), but I'll fix it. p:

Naaah, it's cool!! I really love critiquing too (partially because of the reason you gave, but also because it helps me enforce my own knowledge/makes me realize wtf I need to pay attention to more rather than being lazy).

[hiko27]

AH DAMMIT. Okay, these links you can see now.

And it's fine. I should really be drawing but anything to help out really. And yeah, there are some things you should be in the habit of doing. Like I know some people don't draw people naked first, but you kinda need to unless you're a master of anatomy and you can eyeball it all. Most of the time, people can't eyeball it correctly, which is why drawing them naked to the bare guides help. And for the thumb, it doesn't exactly start at the middle because there's a tendon there, but it's close to the middle. Try observing your hand, move your thumb to the inside of your palm and you'll notice it's at the middle. And for the upper right, yeah, her right foot. Sorry, I get so confusing when I try and explain these things orz But in short, her right foot is in an unnatural position. I know some people are bow-legged and whatever the heck is the opposite, but I don't think you were trying to show that. If you were, just ignore the correction about her leg then. For the backgrounds, it's fine. I don't think anybody else would really notice it, I'm just nitpicky, that's why. I do get what you mean though by trying to make some things look cool.

Still feel bad because I felt like I just K'Oed you or something. It's scary to give critique sometimes since a whole lot of people (mostly us artists) get offended very easily. (Though imo, critiques are needed, and not being overconfident in your skill is a must to improve and all that)

[chocojax]

Thanks so much, yo! Def' gonna save them to learn from. (Also, your instructor's art style looks really similar, to this one guy's figure drawing book that I have. But might just be because they both used color pencils to sketch, lol.)

Yeaaah. Sometimes when I'm suuuper lazy, I don't draw the body at all (or just a stick figure) and it always comes out badly. p:

No, don't feel bad!!! I honestly really appreciate that you took the time to do all of that for me. qq

(It's usually scary for me to give critique 'cause I'm second-guessing myself all the time, worried that I've been thinking about X wrong all this time and I'll seem stupid -> frantic googling.)

I also swear that I'll post the thread on the art studies thing tomorrow, I just wanted to make it look/sound nice. :p

[hiko27]

You're welcome! Don't think my instructor has released a book, but probably. My instructor does like Tintoretto a whole lot, so they both probably like him? Random, but I actually think sketching with color pencils is better than normal HB pencils. Gives your drawing a bit of warmth to it (well, depending on what color you use. In my case, he made us use either red or close to red).

Haha, that does happen to me sometimes though, though not as much nowadays. Been getting into the habit of drawing the figure first because I'm always frustrated at how later on, something's off and I have to go back and redo the coloring, the lineart and pretty much fix it without fixing the surrounding areas. So been trying to just correct the figure early on in the process. Oh man, I know how that feels. I usually read whatever I send or post online, just to check grammar, and there are times I just read what I wrote and I go, "...What?" But yeah, I think it's good to an extent that you're second guessing yourself (when it comes to drawing I mean), but from experience, you won't be able to finish the piece if you keep doing that. That's how it is for me, so there are times I just draw without consulting my friends for opinions on the pose and anatomy and all that.