Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

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Taleweaver
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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#16 Post by Taleweaver » Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:00 am

LVUER wrote:In the end, it's up to player's skill, right?
It SHOULD be up to player's skill. In good fighting games, the choice of character only determines who among two players of the same skill level will win most of the time and maybe gives a player who's a little weaker than another an edge against the stronger player. However, if a novice player can defeat an experienced one with little more than button-mashing, something's wrong with the power level of the characters.

Smash Bros Brawl is very guilty of this. Samurai Swords 2 also suffered from character under/overpowerment, though not as dramatically. Sieger / Ukyo battles still aren't pretty to watch.
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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#17 Post by Enigma » Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:08 pm

LVUER wrote:In the end, it's up to player's skill, right? I still remembered when I play Need For Speed 2 (not a fighting game, I know). I raced against my brother. I used a slow car with the best handling and he used the best car in the game (all stats highest except for handling which is a little bit lower than my car). We raced in circular racing track that usually used in Indy race (similar to race track in Pixar's "Car"). It seemed obvious that my bro will won, but not only I beat him, I also broke the track and lap record. He never wanted to race against me ever since that time.
In a properly balanced game this is true, but in some games (The Street fighter 3: 3rd Strike and entire Marvel vs. Capcom series for example) some characters are unviable at any level beyond button mashing.

To elaborate, I have a friend who play May in Guilty Gear (one of the top characters) and beat him every time with Johnny (lowest teir) because the game is properly balanced, but in Marvel vs. Capcom I can't be a low teir hero because it's just not possible, you lack too many options.

Usually talking about tiers becomes...bad so I should explain what tier means, it's a combonation of a rating of a characters strengths and weaknesses, and the number match ups that character has in their favor. Some times low-teir characters have match ups in their favor against top teirs (like bottom tier Briget vs. high tier Potemkin in Guilty gear). There are tiers in every game, but in a properly balanced game, the worst match up in the game should be 6-4, with maybe one or two 7-3 match ups, and the more skilled player will generally win.

Actually, while I'm dispensing knowledge, if anyone wants help learning fighting games, I can lend you some knowledge, or you could just go to dustloop or shoryuken.com to get someone better to help.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#18 Post by SleepKirby » Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:45 am

I went to a Smash Bros. Brawl tournament (UCSD Winter Gamefest) and lost every match, mainly because I just don't play at a high level. I just thought it'd be interesting to experience tournament level play firsthand. It was still fairly fun because I didn't take it seriously (but getting chainthrowed was lame, I won't deny that >_> ).

I play non-fighting games competitively though. I'm involved in video game speedrunning, which means attempting to beat a game (or reach some goal in the game) in the fastest possible time. Speed Demos Archive and Speedrunslive are my go-to sites for that (check out the live streams in particular).

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#19 Post by Enigma » Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:51 pm

SleepKirby wrote:I went to a Smash Bros. Brawl tournament (UCSD Winter Gamefest) and lost every match, mainly because I just don't play at a high level. I just thought it'd be interesting to experience tournament level play firsthand. It was still fairly fun because I didn't take it seriously (but getting chainthrowed was lame, I won't deny that >_> ).

I play non-fighting games competitively though. I'm involved in video game speedrunning, which means attempting to beat a game (or reach some goal in the game) in the fastest possible time. Speed Demos Archive and Speedrunslive are my go-to sites for that (check out the live streams in particular).
You should see me blow through a final fantasy game as quick as possible (reccommend level sixty, pfft, I'll do it at level forty and call it a day.)

I myself don't play smash all that often, but I hear the barrier of entry is pretty huge, cause there is no such thing as a mid level player, only casuals and high level.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#20 Post by Kuroneko_rg » Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:37 am

I used to play Melty Blood Actress Again (Never tournament nor online) and I was quite addicted for a while. KOF 2002 UM was a lot of fun too, and I still play whenever my cousin brings the challenge on.

Right now I'm playing Dissidia 012, which is also very fun to play. I still haven't beaten the story mode so no spoilers please.

But if I must say something, I truly miss having a good fight in Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3.

I suck at Tekken, and at Street Fighter as well. Curiously, I'm quite good with Marvel vs Capcom.

I wonder if Enigma was referring to beating Final Fantasy IX in 12 hours. Never done it. I'm not that good.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#21 Post by KimiYoriBaka » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:20 pm

hmm...ultimate mortal kombat 3 and marvel vs. capcom? sounds like you've got more affinity with party games. both of those are ones that I would associate with games like mario party that are less fun to play competitively and more fun to play with a large group of random people at no particular skill level.

I'm not saying they're bad games or anything; they are definitely entertaining games, but for very different reasons.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#22 Post by Kuroneko_rg » Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:27 pm

KimiYoriBaka wrote:hmm...ultimate mortal kombat 3 and marvel vs. capcom? sounds like you've got more affinity with party games. both of those are ones that I would associate with games like mario party that are less fun to play competitively and more fun to play with a large group of random people at no particular skill level.

I'm not saying they're bad games or anything; they are definitely entertaining games, but for very different reasons.

You are right about Marvel vs Capcom. The game is pretty much smash the buttons until you win. UMK 3 requires quite some
degree of skill to play though. None of my friends could never be at my level, while they were good in other fighting games
like Tekken and KOF (I suck at Tekken).
I also mentioned Melty Blood AA and KOF 2002 UM. I'd like to hear what you think about them.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#23 Post by Enigma » Tue Jun 19, 2012 1:09 am

Melty Blood seems good from what little I've played. It's very competitive too, though for some reason Melty Blood players seem to like hating on Skullgirls (no idea why). I only played the newest KOF, and it was pretty fun, I never got competitive at it because there are no airdashes though, even though Mai had great mobility. MK and MvC are both crap at balance, but are pretty fun to play. MvC especially, MK also has weird inputs, but I love tearing peoples arms of so...

I'm strangely bad at games that lack mobility options like air dashes and double jumps, except Darkstalkers 3 where I play a mean Lilith (even though Q-Bee, Hsien-Ko, Jedah, and Lord Raptor/Zabel/Zombie can airdash I don't like any of them).

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#24 Post by Kuroneko_rg » Tue Jun 19, 2012 1:32 am

Another fighting I used to play in a very competitive way was Bloody Roar 2.
Bloody Roar 3 and 4 were okay, but for some reason I couldn't find myself enjoying them as much I enjoyed the second.
KOF Maximum Impact was a well accepted change to the series. KOF XIII is still "classic" but fails to be as addictive as the older
versions (Also, having Iori without fire is somewhat boring).

I stopped being a fan of MK after IV, which awfully failed to succeed UMK3. I tried MK Armageddon and I thought it to be a crappy attempt to recreate MK Trilogy. I've heard amazing things of the new MK, but I haven't played it.

Also, Melty Blood have some balance problems with some characters. If you face someone who is good with Ciel, you will find yourself
in one hell of a battle. I was very good with Akiha, and yet my cousin kicked my ass with Ciel while I beaten him whenever he used
Shiki T, Aoko or Arcueid.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#25 Post by Enigma » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:44 am

You can get Iori with fire as DLC, jsut saying. Claw Iori is pretty cool too.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#26 Post by Kuroneko_rg » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:56 am

A friend of mine gave me an emulated version of the arcade game. I've read on wiki about the DLC content in console versions
but I can't get them of course.
Yeah, claw Iori is pretty cool (I was like "no fire, no Iori" until I saw his craziness was intact).
Still, is nice to see KOF XIII going for the classic feeling of the saga.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#27 Post by KimiYoriBaka » Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:42 am

I also mentioned Melty Blood AA and KOF 2002
Melty Blood Act Cadenza is one of my personal favs, but when I tried Actress Again, I felt too much like I was playing guilty gear (which isn't a bad game itself, but if I wanted to play GG I would just play GG). That said, I've never owned AA myself, so my knowlege of that one is limited. I do know that most of the balance issues in the melty blood series before that were ones that mainly just apply to the lower half of the skill range. nero and ciel are kind of ridiculous to play against if you aren't good with super-jumps for example. oddly enough, though, every time I've seen newbies play a melty blood game, they seem to enjoy it regardless.

KOF 2002 always seemed to me like a simplified version of KOF 98, which is my fav game in the kof series.
UMK 3 requires quite some
degree of skill to play though.
the reason I consider that one (as well as pretty much the whole series) more of a party game is not because of the skill needed to play well at it. it's because of how the players are encouraged to play by the game itself. I've never seen more spam accusations or attempts at more stupid tactics in any other game franchise, and I can't help but wonder, looking back, if the makers intended the game to be like that so they could get more quarters from the players. at the very least, the choppy animations and downright bizarre running and blocking do nothing to help the player to figure out how to play fluidly.

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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#28 Post by Taleweaver » Tue Jun 19, 2012 9:12 am

By the way, does anyone remember Queen of Heart '98, the KoF/To Heart mashup? Think "datable VN girls beating one another up" - THAT was fun! Not a game to play competetively, but still...
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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#29 Post by LVUER » Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:32 pm

Taleweaver wrote:By the way, does anyone remember Queen of Heart '98, the KoF/To Heart mashup? Think "datable VN girls beating one another up" - THAT was fun! Not a game to play competetively, but still...
OK, now I WANT to play it... Can't find any info though... do you have any additional info/links regarding the game?
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Re: Anyone Else here Play Fighting Games Competitively?

#30 Post by Taleweaver » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:43 am

LVUER wrote:OK, now I WANT to play it... Can't find any info though... do you have any additional info/links regarding the game?
Found some info here.

Check out a few Abandonware sites; maybe someone has a download. I think this is a Doujin game anyway.
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