That's the Way the Cookie Crumbles [GxB, BakeSim] (Hiatus)

[Alwerien]

Oh, and one last thing: I didn't have any trouble with saving/loading... I don't know if there were invisible problems, but everything seemed fine to me!

I think the save/load problem was only in the 1.0 version of demo

[chocojax]

1. Who is your favorite character and why?
I liked Santos instantly. Mostly because I also like Sudoku and turtles, lol. And I tend to like guys with glasses. P: (Tybs was also cute, haha.)
2. What is your favorite line or scene? How's the humor?
Well, I kinda spammed with the hangan with Santos choices, so I liked the part where MC talks to him about his cooking, and he blushes. Soooo qt.
I feel kinda neutral about the humor, but I usually don't laugh/smile at jokes/silly things unless they're really amazing, lol.
3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it?
Just that the there was so much empty space around the sprites. This is kinda a good thing though, since it adds to the illusion(?) that the shop is amazingly spacious.
Also, I was paying attention to the text mainly, so since the sprites were so tall, I couldn't really notice their changes in expression, haha. This is probably just me, though.
4. How long do you think you could play the baking sim section before you get bored? What would help you be willing to play that portion longer?
I got bored around the 2nd/3rd day in. That's only because there was no reason at the time to actually make money, so I just saved a list and made it every day. It'll probably be less boring once the full version comes out, and you can do something with that money! Like, updating the shop, making it bigger, or something. Or going on dates on weekends or whatnot, lool.
5. Do the baking and visual novel portions transition smoothly from one mode to another?
Slightly. x:
6. Was Info/Profile screen helpful (deciding during a choice menu, understanding the characters, etc.)? How often did you check it?
I noticed the Info/Profile screen when I started to answer these questions, lol. I did skim through the character info in the beginning of this thread, and it helped me slightly.
7. How could the baking sim be more fun/visually attractive?
Stuff in question 4? Also, if you have enough time on your hands, show a "preview" of what you're gonna bake! C: Like how when you hover over each category and a picture shows up, show a picture of a raspberry scone or something! Haha.
8. Rate us on a scale of 1 to 10 on how all the elements come together. Does it feel like a cohesive game?
If 5 is average, maybe a 6 or 7. The baking sim is really interesting, and adding a dating sim along with that is fun too. I'm not sure if they come togther well or not, though. It didn't feel choppy at least.

---

The sudden long list of names to gossip about/learn from is kinda intimidating. I kinda skipped those parts because I didn't want to click on every single one, haha. Just a suggestion, but maybe incorporating the character info in along with the words, rather than having people pick choices for them, would be better?

I noticed a weird bug? Not sure if this is happening to everyone else, but on my second day, I noticed that I somehow failed at baking a Chocolate Cake, Raspberry Scone, and a Vanilla Cake. So, I took those three out of my list on the third day. After baking everything on the list, I was told again that I didn't make a Chocolate Cake, Raspberry Scone, and a Vanilla Cake correctly. x: Sorry, I don't quite remember what combination I did though.

The textbox background is really cool looking, and matches the fun music/atmosphere of the VN. Though, it kinda feels too big, especially since most of the dialogue/thoughts go from 1 to 2 lines.

The art is pretty simple, but it fits the VN. They stand out pretty easily from the background because of the black lines, but still match because of the saturation/brightness of colors? Lol. I also like their outfits, especially Renee's because she looks *stylish*.

Overall, I think it's pretty interesting. Looking forward to more demos/the finalized product. P:

[Cidz]

1. Who is your favorite character and why? I think i like Alfonse, he is so cute! I also like Aaron, because socially awkward forgetful boys are cute. I kind of like Santos,because i have a weak spot for glasses. ~
2. What is your favorite line or scene? How's the humor? Hmm, i don't have a fav. scene. I only played the demo through once, oh! i thought it was cute and funny how renea (sp?) wanted to paint alfonse's nails and how he was like "uhh get her away from me!" That made me lol.
3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it? Hmm....is there a way to overwrite the lists you saved? if not, could i maybe suggest that?
4. How long do you think you could play the baking sim section before you get bored? What would help you be willing to play that portion longer? for ever! really, for some odd reason i never get bored of things like this.
5. Do the baking and visual novel portions transition smoothly from one mode to another? Yeah, works great!
6. Was Info/Profile screen helpful (deciding during a choice menu, understanding the characters, etc.)? How often did you check it? Pretty useful, i only used it once. I was curious what the info button was. Maybe in the full version i would use it more.
7. How could the baking sim be more fun/visually attractive? UHm, i like it as is so far! so i cant really think of anything at the moment.
8. Rate us on a scale of 1 to 10 on how all the elements come together. Does it feel like a cohesive game? I would say an 8. Fun demo, i would play the full version of this game without a doubt! hmm...maybe i would get it an 8.5 instead? im really bad at raiting >_<

oh and i want to say i love the textbox and the overall design and art! its so cute!

[CheeryMoya]

Oh wow, thanks for all your input guys! I do read all of them :3

5. Do the baking and visual novel portions transition smoothly from one mode to another?
Kinda...my computer is kinda old so it took awhile for the transition to happen.

Ah yeah, old computers will definitely lag since the code's rather unwieldy and large. We're going to have to find a way to trim it down to make it more efficient.

6. Was Info/Profile screen helpful (deciding during a choice menu, understanding the characters, etc.)? How often did you check it?
Not really. I kinda forget about it and when I did checked on it, the 'romance progress' hardly move--which made me think whether I actually did something or not.

I was in a rush so I didn't code that part in, but I will in the next demo update and for the finished game of course.

Also, since the MC is also the manager of the bakery, it would be nice to see more on that side of things such as marketing/employee relations/inventory buying--you know, things that a manager can do to improve or kill a business. Otherwise, just stick the MC as a baker if you're going to have just a baking simulation.

We're planning on it! While making Elise just a baker seems easier, it'd change everything storywise and defeat the whole purpose of the game.

Then with Joshua, I'm surprise he's Chinese considering he has a Vietnamese last name. Though what put me off was the emphasis on the Chinese language and to me, I'm just thinking that well, what happen to the Vietnamese? I would assume he knows both...but hey, if he only knows Chinese, that's realistic as well. This is something that the MC could explore on--along with the blue eyes.

Lol, my family history can only hope to be as crazy as his. My last name is a Vietnamese corruption of the original surname, which happened when my grandparents moved down there. The preferred language is Chinese in the Nguyen house, they slip into Vietnamese sometimes too. No Russian, but Josh likes to joke about it >_>

1. Who is your favorite character and why?
I like Alfonse, and I like Xavier a lot. I actually like all the characters. (I'm going to have a hard time deciding whether to help Xavier and Terry back together or whether to keep him for myself ^^)
I like Renee very, very much. ^^

Hey there ludeshka! I'm playing Hierofanía right now, enjoying the atmosphere a lot. I'll leave a review in your thread, back to the subject at hand >_>

You can't get Xavier and Terry back together and you can only patch their relationship back to semi-good friend status. That's in the best case scenario, mind you.

Glad you like everyone though! I'm really surprised by how many people like Xav though... he's a hipster you're supposed to point and yell at hipsters

3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it?
One thing jumps to mind. Elise. Some of her lines/thoughts are quite petty. I'm not saying "OMG! she's a b*tch who should die!" just that I'm not sure she's as likable as she thinks she is.

Yup, going to take that out. It was demo only, but if we're updating it we might as well take it out. Easy fix.

I'm an idiot who sucks at minigames and plays VNs for the story, so to make ME play more you'd have to give me STORY. Make it important to the story, as in Al stays and cooks with Elise, or Joshua needs a cake for his relatives....give me story events with the bakery, and you'll get me interested. (Remember the suikoden 2 cookoffs? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KmVtU--qr8 I don't mean anything this complicated, the gameplay can stay as it is, but give me reasons to do things, and I will do them. XD)

Yeah, the guys will buy stuff from you in the story (eg. Al will demand you hand over the White Chocolate Macadamia Nut cookies when he's feeling particularly angst-ridden). We got this

Oh, I know, Al could wear one of those white cook hats. (What? I like those hats!)

Hm, but he's only your part-time cashier :/ Fanservice doesn't care We'll think about it!

Oh and actually for some of the guys I was a bit bugged by the fact the conversation was exactly the same as in the other guy's route. Like that Tybs day with Josh/Xav and Aaron/Santos. Really hoped I would at least get to ask the turtles' names when I played Santos' route instead. Mittens? Lol.

Hm, I don't think it'd be too much a problem in the full game, but I could put a few more variations, yeah. And noooo, you'll have to squeeze out the names of the turtles in the full game

Also, the in-game justification doesn't work, especially since Elise doesn't react to the supposed mind-reading. Plus it's creepy for her to have a notebook full of this info! Why not just say that all of that info is there for the player? We're supposed to be the creepy ones, after all! lol

That was something I was thinking about too. Should we even try to justify the Info Screen or should we let the game itself teach you how to use it?

The VN parts in particular seem a teensy bit short, but IDK if that's b/c of the demo.

I'm used to writing shorter stories, short scenes, etc. Each of the events I've written average out to be 600 words usually, and I'm not entirely happy with how I wrap up events in such a small amount of words. I get the job done, but it's so short! Then again, making it longer for the sake of more wordcount seems a bit frivolous. Weekend events will be longer, but should I extend the events on the weekdays?

3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it?
Just that the there was so much empty space around the sprites. This is kinda a good thing though, since it adds to the illusion(?) that the shop is amazingly spacious.
Also, I was paying attention to the text mainly, so since the sprites were so tall, I couldn't really notice their changes in expression, haha. This is probably just me, though.

The size of the screen is more for the baking sim portion so all the info can fit there without being cramped. Trust me, the default size for Ren'Py would not be good for the baking portions :C The nice thing about the bigger screen though is that I can fit in about 5 characters onto the screen at once if I need to. And apologizes for the tall sprites, the tallest guy (Aaron) is 6 ft 2 in. Those darn giants :/

The art is pretty simple, but it fits the VN. They stand out pretty easily from the background because of the black lines, but still match because of the saturation/brightness of colors?

Ah, the sprites are pretty much going to stay looking like that, but the BGs will get colored and stuff. I'm not particularly a fan of anything that has too many dark hues so you can't see anything at all.

Hmm....is there a way to overwrite the lists you saved? if not, could i maybe suggest that?

Gutsy's still figuring that out, but in the demo you shouldn't need that many lists >_> Full game, you'll be able to overwrite lists.

Thanks for your input everyone! We were already planning to do as you guys have suggested, so we'll get to it :3 BTW, more on that BG:

Elise's room now has a bookshelf! The bedside table is on the other side of the bed, but you don't see it anymore >_>

[ngareci]

Interesting topic for visual novel! And a sweet visual you got there! Cant wait to play the demo! XD

[fiatal]

That was something I was thinking about too. Should we even try to justify the Info Screen or should we let the game itself teach you how to use it?

My first instinct is to just let the game itself do it, but then someone like me would probably not click over to the Info screen for ages. >.<

I'm used to writing shorter stories, short scenes, etc. Each of the events I've written average out to be 600 words usually, and I'm not entirely happy with how I wrap up events in such a small amount of words. I get the job done, but it's so short! Then again, making it longer for the sake of more wordcount seems a bit frivolous. Weekend events will be longer, but should I extend the events on the weekdays?

The more I think about, the more I think the length is okay, especially with longer weekend events. What do you mean, "I'm not entirely happy with how I wrap up events in such a small amount of words"? Is it that you stick close to a word limit so that each character gets the same amount of time?

[FatUnicornGames]

I played through the demo and here are some of my random notes.

-Cute character designs
-Not a big fan of the music it is pretty distracting
-You get these big lists of characters to poke around in and in all honesty it made it really hard to remember what I had learned about who. I feel like if I had visual aids (like we can see who we're talking about) it would have sunk in better. Like the first time I am asked who I want to hang out with I'm like...Uh, I don't really know.
-It might be nice to have more padding around the text in the dialogue box, in particular when the narrator is talking.
-I like the dialogue a lot. It flows pretty naturally.
-Why did I always lose a white bread everyday? Is that a bug?
-I'm totally gonna romance Santos.

So uh, there you go. Hope some of these notes are helpful.

Edit: Here is more.

1. Who is your favorite character and why? Santos! Tsundere with glasses always.
2. What is your favorite line or scene? How's the humor? Not really, maybe the scene with Tybalt? Cute and light.
3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it? I put those above.
4. How long do you think you could play the baking sim section before you get bored? What would help you be willing to play that portion longer? I'm not quite sure what the point of the baking sim was, but if there was more of a reward system, like something to save up money for...that would keep my playing.
5. Do the baking and visual novel portions transition smoothly from one mode to another? Sure.
6. Was Info/Profile screen helpful (deciding during a choice menu, understanding the characters, etc.)? How often did you check it? I didn't really use it honestly.
7. How could the baking sim be more fun/visually attractive? More pictures of the different baked goods?
8. Rate us on a scale of 1 to 10 on how all the elements come together. Does it feel like a cohesive game? For a demo about a 7-8?

I liked it, good luck finishing.

[Destiny]

Tried the demo yesterday but wasn't able to write a review.

First:
When I played through it the shop went well with having +500$ at the end.
After that one every playthrough ended with at least -200$ if not -800$.
Often ALL my food was lost or there just survived a peach cookie and a black forest cake.
It became REALLY frustrating to now know how to change that (are the stars for how difficult the food is or for how well received? And how does that even matter if none of the food survives the baking?

Second:
The conversations flow nicely, I love especially how all characters react to Tybalts name xD

Third:
The sprites look great and fit good to the said stuff.

The info box is really helpfull (because the characters mix I always read who was who (at first I constantly thought Terry was a boy). The thoughts help by understanding the characters, etc.

1. Who is your favorite character and why?
Santos, I like such cold arrogant guys :3
Second favorite is Joshua.

2. What is your favorite line or scene? How's the humor?
The scene with Aaron and Santos about Tybalts name ("Mitten the kitten" xD)

3. Were there any parts of the game that bugged you? How can we improve it?
Well, like I said, that I constantly lost my food and - because of that - made never real money but only lost it.
You get less and less interested in playing when you loose about 200$ each round.

4. How long do you think you could play the baking sim section before you get bored? What would help you be willing to play that portion longer?
Well, it's not THAT hard or complex, so I would play it on the side. Only playing that would become boring quickly since you only choose the food, watch how much get's lost and then look if you earned something and - if yes - how much.
A mini game for baking could make the interest in it bigger that could make the food improve, make the risk of loosing food smaller or make you earn more.

5. Do the baking and visual novel portions transition smoothly from one mode to another?
Yeah, I think it is good.

6. Was Info/Profile screen helpful (deciding during a choice menu, understanding the characters, etc.)? How often did you check it?
Yes, I found it very helpful and checked it at regular basis. Even though I used it mainly to know who was behind name X

7. How could the baking sim be more fun/visually attractive?
Look at point 4

8. Rate us on a scale of 1 to 10 on how all the elements come together. Does it feel like a cohesive game?
I would give it a 7. The missing three points are for the baking sim getting disappoint by constantly loosing money without being able to do something about it

[CheeryMoya]

What do you mean, "I'm not entirely happy with how I wrap up events in such a small amount of words"? Is it that you stick close to a word limit so that each character gets the same amount of time?

It's not that I sit down and tell myself to write around 600 words or else, I just start typing my thing and when I'm done with it, it happens to be 600 words. I guess I just subconsciously stick to what I need for the scene. If I weren't writing a VN, my wordcount would go up the roof since I love my imagery, but that's beside the point >_>
@FatUnicornGames: Thanks for the feedback, we've added more padding to the textbox now. And yeah, there's been a bug where the game says you lost something, but you may not have made that item that day.
@Destiny: H-how could Terry be a boy? ;n; An actual baking minigame would be super hard to program and that gets tedious too after a while, so the chances we'll do that is very slim. Still, thanks for your feedback!

In other news, here's progress on the ever popular bedroom!

I put Al there to see how sprites look... just in case the need for any sprites other than Elise's in here ever arises. The other BGs will also get polished like this so it only gets even better! We're pushing for August 8 for a demo update with the updated images and hopefully some fixes to the baking sim.
And thanks to everyone who participated in the Support Drive! We hit our goal of $100 and a little more, and our gift to everyone is a sidestory KN of the TWCC cast~! If you want to be listed as a donor, today is literally the last day during this drive to donate. You have to send at least $3 via PayPal, and details for that can be found on this page. We may do another drive in the future, and we'll announce it when the time comes.

We'd also like some opinions on this little thing pertaining to the bake sim portion of the game; how many recipes would you like to see in the final game? Right now we have 105 recipe names collected, and I want to aim for 150 unique types of recipes to choose from. Ideally, most items would get their own image, but is 150 recipes reasonable? Should we stick to 100 or go for as many as we can find? Would you be okay with candy items appearing in the cafe category (peanut brittle, things like that)? Tell us what you think.

P.S. See my new siggy? We'll let you guys have a nifty banner of your favorite boy to put in your forum signatures too if you want, we're figuring out how to set up a page on the website for goodies >_> Till next time!

[kaleidofish]

We'd also like some opinions on this little thing pertaining to the bake sim portion of the game; how many recipes would you like to see in the final game? Right now we have 105 recipe names collected, and I want to aim for 150 unique types of recipes to choose from. Ideally, most items would get their own image, but is 150 recipes reasonable? Should we stick to 100 or go for as many as we can find? Would you be okay with candy items appearing in the cafe category (peanut brittle, things like that)? Tell us what you think.

Is 150 recipes reasonable to you? (Don't you love it when people ask your questions back to you?) I like the wide variety that 150 recipes would entail, but I'm the type of baker that only focuses on about 10 recipes. Would there be an incentive in the game for baking particular recipes at certain times? Otherwise, the 105 might be alright.

I've ordered peanut brittle at my local cafe before, so I'm okay with candy being in that section.

[CheeryMoya]

Is 150 recipes reasonable to you? (Don't you love it when people ask your questions back to you?)

ಠ╭╮ಠ

I like the wide variety that 150 recipes would entail, but I'm the type of baker that only focuses on about 10 recipes. Would there be an incentive in the game for baking particular recipes at certain times? Otherwise, the 105 might be alright.

Variety is the spice of life, so we're trying to figure out a way to make a certain good less appealing if you keep spamming it in your menu. You have to put an item in your shop for it to get popular, but you should shuffle the selection sometimes. That's where your saved lists of menus can come in handy.
There's also seasonal items like pumpkin pie; during autumn they'll be immensely popular, but other times of the year it won't sell too well.

I've ordered peanut brittle at my local cafe before, so I'm okay with candy being in that section.

We'll resort to candy recipes if we can't find enough baked stuff to get us up to 150.

We still need a few more opinions on this though D: Talk to ussssss

[Arowana]

Sure, candy is good. I like candy. Ethnic desserts could be nice, too, if you haven't already considered those. I love Asian pastries like melon bread and egg tarts and moon cakes and...(just went to the Asian bakery, sorry).

I think 150 recipes would be reasonable only if you can get unique images for each of the items, and if the items are sufficiently different with respect to seasonal popularity, required baking effort, and other stats. (No point in having a bunch of items with the different names, but essentially the same stats). If you have limited resources, then I would prefer fewer recipes with higher quality images/descriptions.

Personally, though, I don't think I would use all 150 recipes, but maybe they could be fun to collect for completionists. Like if you've ever played Pokemon, you might catch all 150 Pokemon for bragging rights, but only use like 6-10 consistently. Will there be bonuses for collecting more recipes as well? Again with the Pokemon analogy (lol sorry, I can't help but think of Pokemon with the number 150), you would get special items or powerups every time you reached a new milestone number of Pokemon seen.

[Reikun]

Hello everyone *0* I recently got done with Elise's bedroom background! Here's a preview for when it's raining :3

[Veniae]

Eeee, that's great! ouo I love the colours!

[CheeryMoya]

Sure, candy is good. I like candy. Ethnic desserts could be nice, too, if you haven't already considered those. I love Asian pastries like melon bread and egg tarts and moon cakes and...(just went to the Asian bakery, sorry).

We were thinking of putting in mooncake and the like in the recipe list, and we agreed that storywise the Greene Bakery would have neither the equipment nor ingredients (on-hand at anytime unless they specially ordered it) to make ethnic deserts such as mooncake. Trust me, mooncakes have fillings such as red bean, mung bean, salted egg yolk, etc. that aren't typically found outside of Asian bakeries so it would be highly unusual to include them here :/ Still, it's a game, we could take a few liberties if we wanted to, and if enough players want to see those kinds of items we can add it to the list. Thoughts?

Personally, though, I don't think I would use all 150 recipes, but maybe they could be fun to collect for completionists. Like if you've ever played Pokemon, you might catch all 150 Pokemon for bragging rights, but only use like 6-10 consistently. Will there be bonuses for collecting more recipes as well? Again with the Pokemon analogy (lol sorry, I can't help but think of Pokemon with the number 150), you would get special items or powerups every time you reached a new milestone number of Pokemon seen.

Hm, bonuses for collecting them all? I actually can't think of how bonuses would work besides unlocking extra images and stuff. Maybe a special picture in the art gallery would be enough? What would you like to see if you unlocked all 150 and more to see recipes in the game?