Performance Warnings - how common?

[PyTom]

Does anyone have any data or intuition as to how many Ren'Py users are getting performance warnings from the latest version of Ren'Py? Are there very many people who are using Ren'Py with the pure software driver, rather than OpenGL or ANGLE?

I'd like to get some information about this to plan out future Ren'Py development. Most notably, I'm planning to drop the software renderer entirely, and I'm wondering if I need to use Mesa to replace it, or if I can just omit pure software rendering starting sometime in 2013.

[nyaatrap]

I got only one report of performance problem on my game. Though my game requires OpenGL and 1GB ram to play it - it's unusual heavy game.

I think the major problem is mainly caused by the buggy unupdated Intel driver. They can play games with the software renderer instead of updating the Intel driver which requires technical knowledge (I had a trouble on it myself T_T).

[jack_norton]

Really a few cases (I'd say 1 out of 100 support email), and most were because the user didn't know how to install proper GL/DX drivers
I've much more problems about people not having the right DX drivers installed but that's another story of course.

[papillon]

I haven't been using the latest version of RenPy because of (stuff related to Spiky) - but I do get support emails from people who have to be instructed to use the software renderer. Including Steam users!

It's possible that updating their drivers in some way would also fix their problem but that's much trickier to negotiate when trying to help people over email, especially as customers are not always the most tech-savvy people in the world and do not necessarily understand complex instructions.

For that matter I'm in the middle of trying to fix someone's problem RIGHT NOW which may be a GL-related bug (although we're not sure yet; his case is weird)

It's a pretty small percentage, I suppose, but they do exist.

[Spiky Caterpillar]

In my experience, 3D acceleration on the Linux desktop is a buggy mess that is effectively unusable for a very large fraction of installed systems. My main devbox gives a performance warning in 6.13.8; I don't think I'd tried anything in 6.13.x on my previous devbox, but the version of Ren'Py I was using at the time triggered a memory leak somewhere in X if I used it in OpenGL mode.

The performance warning screen also, IIRC, showed up on a virginal Windows 7 install, and I've seen reports that users are somewhat befuddled by the fact that they have to update their drivers when they already have the newest version of DX(10? 11? Whichever Win7 ships with.)

[jack_norton]

Yes that happens because the Angle renderer requires DX9.0c (lol) and since you can have multiple version of DX installed users gets that message. Though I think from the new DX11 that shouldn't happen anymore (not 100% sure).

[VenusEclipse]

I'm using the current version of Ren'Py. There's a small percentage that need to run my current game with the software renderer. Their computer is current, using Windows 7, etc. We've already tried updating their graphics drivers, and getting them up to date with Direct X. The last option was to use software renderer, and that worked.

The performance problem pop up is random. I got it once. A friend got it more randomly, and he has a more powerful computer, and a few programs running at the same time.

[nyaatrap]

BTW, I heard KK2, the most popular VN engine, has a policy of anti-GPU. I think this policy is old-fashioned and it's one of the reason I don't use KK2. But I also think at least there is a legitimate reason on this policy from their experience.

[papillon]

(related - I recall we had a few users here who had to switch renderers to get all the graphics working in the Adversity Comp, and there are people with problems in the Heartstring Bugs thread as well...)

[PyTom]

BTW, I heard KK2, the most popular VN engine, has a policy of anti-GPU. I think this policy is old-fashioned and it's one of the reason I don't use KK2. But I also think at least there is a legitimate reason on this policy from their experience.

Honestly, I resisted for as long as I could. But it's hard to do an HD game without some sort of GPU helping, if you want to keep your framerate up.

Now I want to embrace something like OpenGL 2, as shaders would make a lot of what we do easier.

[LateWhiteRabbit]

BTW, I heard KK2, the most popular VN engine, has a policy of anti-GPU. I think this policy is old-fashioned and it's one of the reason I don't use KK2. But I also think at least there is a legitimate reason on this policy from their experience.

Honestly, I resisted for as long as I could. But it's hard to do an HD game without some sort of GPU helping, if you want to keep your framerate up.

Now I want to embrace something like OpenGL 2, as shaders would make a lot of what we do easier.

This is honestly the only thing keeping me from jumping into RenPy feet first. I keep thinking I'll use it for a project (I love coding in Python), but I always run into my HD art being too heavy for solid framerates, even with me optimizing all I can. Renpy is really more ideal for the TYPE of game I'm making, but I need an engine like Unity that can use a GPU to do some heavy lifting. I keep getting surprised by how little it takes to bog the software renderer down in Renpy when it comes to HD sprites and backgrounds.

You're right - HD visual novel gaming desperately needs a Renpy with GPU support.

[nyaatrap]

I laughed hard when I test my current developing game (all images are 1536~3840px) with the software renderer. Its animations is apparently 60 fps with GPU, but when I disable it, it's around 3 fps.

[PyTom]

This is honestly the only thing keeping me from jumping into RenPy feet first. I keep thinking I'll use it for a project (I love coding in Python), but I always run into my HD art being too heavy for solid framerates, even with me optimizing all I can. Renpy is really more ideal for the TYPE of game I'm making, but I need an engine like Unity that can use a GPU to do some heavy lifting. I keep getting surprised by how little it takes to bog the software renderer down in Renpy when it comes to HD sprites and backgrounds.

I'm confused.

Ren'Py has been using the GPU for years, now - to the point where I'm trying to figure out how to get rid of the fallback, so I can add features that depend on the GPU.

[TrickWithAKnife]

Not a performance warning as such, but I do find trying to show an animation using large images looks very choppy.

[nyaatrap]

If the delay is occurred when their first showing, the problem is image loading and cashing. Preloading images behind scenes solves this delay:

Code: Select all

init python:
    def load(image_list):
        for i in image_list:
            renpy.show(i, behind=["bg"])
            renpy.with_statement(Dissolve(.001))
            renpy.hide(i)

This will work on any kind of images even the case when renpy.predict() doesn't work.