Movement [GxG] [Drama] [Friendship] [Romance] [KN]

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meiri
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Movement [GxG] [Drama] [Friendship] [Romance] [KN]

#1 Post by meiri » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:27 pm

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[/center]

Progress:
Writing: 30%
Story Outline: 60%
Sprites: 100%
Backgrounds: 40%
Programming: 80%
CGs: 20%
GUI: 50%
Music: ???

Questions for you:
  1. How do you feel about the brand new thread design?!
  2. Is the art unique?
  3. Does the concept/story/gameplay interest you at all? Do you think it could use more to make it more interesting?
  4. Would you like to see any more information?
  5. What do you look forward to seeing in the demo? How do you think the option to browse the internet on feminist topics will affect the gameplay? Do you like the idea? Would you want to disable it?
  6. Do YOU have any comments or questions for me? :D
Thank you for viewing! Hope to see many comments and much interest!
Last edited by meiri on Sun Dec 14, 2014 1:21 pm, edited 13 times in total.
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#2 Post by pocoscon » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:53 pm

The title might make some feel offended, but really I can see why it's used for the story. I don't think many will have a problem with this. It's going by what you are writing. I also know you don't believe in what the logo is saying either because I read this whole page and I get what you made it for

2- Yes actually. It's really calm looking, and I'd play it, but it's the writing that will make it memerable for me.

3-Yes. I haven't found any games that touch on feminism, so this is definitely interesting =). Just make sure to read up on the subject, so you don't make mistakes.

4-No, can't think of any.

5- Like I said, this is a unique game in my opinion. I'm just wondering how you're going to make personality based choices. I know that's going to be hard @_@
Black Lotus(A work in progress)- (BxB,Horror,Thriller,Fantasy) Tells the story of a boy who must save his home and friends from dangerous creatures known as the Tainted. http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 43&t=28588


Catching the Sun(A work in progress)- (GxG,Slice of Life,Friendship,Drama)

http://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewto ... 43&t=29404

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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#3 Post by Mad Harlequin » Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:09 pm

The logo is misspelled. I realize you wanted to include both the male and female symbols, but perhaps you can do it another way. (No, I'm not offended by the title.)

I like that the art isn't too anime-influenced. Deja in particular looks like she's representative of your own style.

I think you can make a great game if you do your research on the different feminist "waves" and branches---as feminism is hardly one-size-fits-all---and really polish your writing. (The word "make" is missing from the first screenshot.)
I'm an aspiring writer and voice talent with a passion for literature and an unhealthy attachment to video games. I am also a seasoned typo-sniper. Inquiries are encouraged. Friendly chats are welcome.
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#4 Post by meiri » Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:52 pm

pocoscon wrote:The title might make some feel offended, but really I can see why it's used for the story. I don't think many will have a problem with this. It's going by what you are writing. I also know you don't believe in what the logo is saying either because I read this whole page and I get what you made it for

2- Yes actually. It's really calm looking, and I'd play it, but it's the writing that will make it memerable for me.

3-Yes. I haven't found any games that touch on feminism, so this is definitely interesting =). Just make sure to read up on the subject, so you don't make mistakes.

4-No, can't think of any.

5- Like I said, this is a unique game in my opinion. I'm just wondering how you're going to make personality based choices. I know that's going to be hard @_@
I'm glad to see that you don't think it's too problematic. (That's certainly one of my main worries with my progress of the vn.)

3: Certainly. I see much, much research in my future. ;)

5: Thanks! It'll be difficult in some ways, but definitely worthwhile.
Mad Harlequin wrote:The logo is misspelled. I realize you wanted to include both the male and female symbols, but perhaps you can do it another way. (No, I'm not offended by the title.)

I like that the art isn't too anime-influenced. Deja in particular looks like she's representative of your own style.

I think you can make a great game if you do your research on the different feminist "waves" and branches---as feminism is hardly one-size-fits-all---and really polish your writing. (The word "make" is missing from the first screenshot.)
Yeah, that is one thing I've also notice: "Scoms." I hope to fix that sometime soon. It's a relief to see you aren't offended by the title.

Thank you! I originally intended for all the art to look more like Deja's style, but it didn't turn out that way.

Thank you for the tip! That'll definitely be something worthwhile to research.
I'll be sure to fix that up ;)
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#5 Post by Caveat Lector » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:23 pm

1. No, not really. It's kind of like these girls are like outcasts, so they embrace the term and reclaim it for themselves, right?

2. Eh, I don't claim to be an expert in art styles, but I do like how you're going for something different.

3. Quite a bit actually! I'm just going off my first impressions here, but it seems to me like you're exploring feminism from the perspective of a young teenage girl who is just beginning to learn the basics of these concepts but has a very immature understanding of what feminism actually is (Deja moreso than Bevelyn). In this area, however, I would advise you be a bit careful. I'm all for teenagers discovering there's a bigger world beyond their ideological bubble and making mistakes along the way, but make sure you don't fall into the trap of reinforcing harmful stereotypes about feminists, especially in regards to Bevelyn.

I'm also a bit put-off by how you use the word feminist in quotation marks for Bevelyn and use phrases like "she believes she's a feminist" because she rants about the disadvantages women have in a patriarchal society, which...not sure what you're going for there, do you mean things like equal pay/inequal pay, media portrayal, reproductive rights, etc.? Because all those are perfectly valid concerns! There's always been this strong pushback against feminism ever since the movement began, but it's become especially ugly in recent years and I think you should make sure this game doesn't fall into encouraging any of that.

4. Like what kind of information? Like any more questions on the project? None off the top of my head, no.

5. Not much, just make sure to do some research on feminism and be careful of stereotypes. Apart from that, I'm looking forward to this game!
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#6 Post by Mad Harlequin » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:42 pm

Caveat Lector wrote:There's always been this strong pushback against feminism ever since the movement began, but it's become especially ugly in recent years and I think you should make sure this game doesn't fall into encouraging any of that.
Seconding this. I didn't comment on the dangers of stereotyping and negativity because I think it's still a bit early and I don't know what's planned, but feminism doesn't (and shouldn't) equate to man-hating or whatever.
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#7 Post by meiri » Tue Sep 16, 2014 10:19 pm

Caveat Lector wrote:1. No, not really. It's kind of like these girls are like outcasts, so they embrace the term and reclaim it for themselves, right?

2. Eh, I don't claim to be an expert in art styles, but I do like how you're going for something different.

3. Quite a bit actually! I'm just going off my first impressions here, but it seems to me like you're exploring feminism from the perspective of a young teenage girl who is just beginning to learn the basics of these concepts but has a very immature understanding of what feminism actually is (Deja moreso than Bevelyn). In this area, however, I would advise you be a bit careful. I'm all for teenagers discovering there's a bigger world beyond their ideological bubble and making mistakes along the way, but make sure you don't fall into the trap of reinforcing harmful stereotypes about feminists, especially in regards to Bevelyn.

I'm also a bit put-off by how you use the word feminist in quotation marks for Bevelyn and use phrases like "she believes she's a feminist" because she rants about the disadvantages women have in a patriarchal society, which...not sure what you're going for there, do you mean things like equal pay/inequal pay, media portrayal, reproductive rights, etc.? Because all those are perfectly valid concerns! There's always been this strong pushback against feminism ever since the movement began, but it's become especially ugly in recent years and I think you should make sure this game doesn't fall into encouraging any of that.

4. Like what kind of information? Like any more questions on the project? None off the top of my head, no.

5. Not much, just make sure to do some research on feminism and be careful of stereotypes. Apart from that, I'm looking forward to this game!
3. The reason feminist is in quotations for Bevelyn is because she was
introduced to the concept from a bad point of view, one that may have been the stereotypical (and negative) view of feminists. Bevelyn's character probably has the best grasp of what feminism really is. However, the way it was presented to her makes it seem like she really doesnt understand it. I don't intend for Bevelyn's character to be misleading-- she truly wants to be a feminist, but didn't really get the right impression of (general) feminism at first.
I'm definitely trying to make sure that message gets through clearly, so I'll definitely need to rephrase Bevelyn's description.

5. Thank you for the tip! Glad to see you're looking forward to it.
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#8 Post by Bto3 » Wed Sep 17, 2014 10:11 pm

1) Does the logo or title offend you? Do you think others could find it offensive? Is it problematic?
Nope! I don't expect anyone else to be offended either unless they're only able to look at it at a surface level.
2) Is the art unique?
It's definitely recognizable! I like your character design a lot~
3) Does the concept/story/gameplay interest you at all? Do you think it could use more to make it more interesting?
It interests me a lot, as a feminist and as someone who's never really seen this as a topic in a game. Unless we count Katawa Shoujo and Kenji's conspiracy theories, which are in a completely different direction than this.
5) Do YOU have any comments or questions for me? :D
You mention that Bevelyn's introduction to feminism was bad. What do you mean by this? For instance, I really disagree with where radical feminists and trans-erasing radical feminists are coming from, but they're still feminists. People with views that fall into those categories didn't just wake up and decide "YEAH LET'S DESTROY ALL MEN!!" They arrived to the conclusion that that was a good idea from their life experiences, first and foremost. So in short, I'd like to see who introduced her to it and perhaps a little on how they arrived to the conclusions about what they did.

I don't know if this is in the cards or not, but it might be interesting to explore what Callie thinks about various branches of feminism.

Good luck on this <3 I hope to see more on this!

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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#9 Post by Mad Harlequin » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:50 am

Bto3 wrote:For instance, I really disagree with where radical feminists and trans-erasing radical feminists are coming from, but they're still feminists!
If creating more opportunities for women requires the destruction of men and transgendered women, that's not feminism anymore. It's just misandry and transphobia in the guise of feminism, IMHO.
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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#10 Post by Bto3 » Thu Sep 18, 2014 5:05 pm

Mad Harlequin wrote:
Bto3 wrote:For instance, I really disagree with where radical feminists and trans-erasing radical feminists are coming from, but they're still feminists!
If creating more opportunities for women requires the destruction of men and transgendered women, that's not feminism anymore. It's just misandry and transphobia in the guise of feminism, IMHO.
In retrospect, I meant to refer more to the base idea of "down with the patriarchy" though that did not come across and ended up being a post that enabled problematic ways of thinking. I apologize for that. Radfems and TERFs are part of a problematic hemisphere of feminism, but in ultimately fighting for the same things, they're feminists. It's a portion of feminism that needs to be condemned (it's a portion that I most certainly condemn).

I will state though that I can understand why radfems may hate men. It's not a good way to go about things at all, it does nothing to better the state of society, but if your entire life has been abusive men, I will not shriek "BUT NOT ALL MEN" because a piece of them understands that, whether they admit it or not.

I really don't want to derail this further with what makes someone a feminist or a good feminist. I simply wanted to make a comment that even the gross feminists got to their conclusion in one way or another. If you'd like to continue this, I'll gladly respond over PM, but I don't want to derail this thread from the actual topic.

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Re: Scums of the Earth [GxG] [Drama]

#11 Post by meiri » Thu Sep 18, 2014 10:27 pm

Bto3 wrote:1) Does the logo or title offend you? Do you think others could find it offensive? Is it problematic?
Nope! I don't expect anyone else to be offended either unless they're only able to look at it at a surface level.
2) Is the art unique?
It's definitely recognizable! I like your character design a lot~
3) Does the concept/story/gameplay interest you at all? Do you think it could use more to make it more interesting?
It interests me a lot, as a feminist and as someone who's never really seen this as a topic in a game. Unless we count Katawa Shoujo and Kenji's conspiracy theories, which are in a completely different direction than this.
5) Do YOU have any comments or questions for me? :D
You mention that Bevelyn's introduction to feminism was bad. What do you mean by this? For instance, I really disagree with where radical feminists and trans-erasing radical feminists are coming from, but they're still feminists. People with views that fall into those categories didn't just wake up and decide "YEAH LET'S DESTROY ALL MEN!!" They arrived to the conclusion that that was a good idea from their life experiences, first and foremost. So in short, I'd like to see who introduced her to it and perhaps a little on how they arrived to the conclusions about what they did.

I don't know if this is in the cards or not, but it might be interesting to explore what Callie thinks about various branches of feminism.

Good luck on this <3 I hope to see more on this!
1) That's great to know!
2) Thanks! <3
3) Glad to see this is a unique and unexplored topic in VNs so far-- although, ath the same time, it'd be great to see more exploring this or simlar topics.
5) This is, actually, a quite important part of the plot, which is only revealed in one of the girl's routes. So as to not spoil anything planned, I don't plan to elaborate much further, but do know that it is explained ;)
As for what I mean by a bad introduction, I think it truly boils down to the individual's definition of a feminist, feminism, etc etc. because some may or may not consider the way it was presented to Bevelyn as "bad" or "false" feminism.

Callie's opinion on feminism will be able to be viewed/discovered by the player-- I plan to try and implement this in a unique way that involves a bit more player interaction. :D

Thanks for your input, I'm very glad to see that you're interested! :)
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Re: Movement [GxG] [Drama]

#12 Post by meiri » Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:11 pm

Update!

Alright, as you can see, we have a brand-spankin'-new title and logo!

Image
I plan to keep this title (except maybe add in a "the") but I'd like to make the logo a little more visually appealing ;).

I've updated the screenshots on the main post, but here is a background sketch of Callie's room:
Image
As for the writing, I've finally got the full story concept worked out, as well as the endings possible and how they will be evaluated-- in total there will 5 endings for Bevelyn and 4 for Deja, making for 9 endings total. I have written about a (short) day's worth of scenes (this VN will not be very very long).

Here are a couple things that I'm considering working on for this project but may or may not be possible:
  • Custom GUI
  • Redone sprites
  • Extended player interaction beyond just choices (through the use of screens)
So in summary, I think everything is coming along very nicely, and I hope to put out a demo sometime soon. :D
(Also, I hope to put these little updates out once or twice a week ;))
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Re: Movement [GxG] [Drama]

#13 Post by meiri » Sun Sep 28, 2014 1:12 pm

Update #2!
For this week, in terms of writing, I haven't gotten much writing done, aside from some plotting and writing in Bevelyn's route.

However, I have made progress in that "extended interaction" I keep blabbing about! It involves quite a bit of programming so over this past week I've been working on that, and here is a preview:
Image
Yup, it's a search engine!
And now you ask: "Why on earth have you blurred out part of the image?" ... To prevent spoilers, of course!
Ho ho, I'll leave you wondering just how these websites affect the storyline. ;)

I've finished the background shown last week, so I'm glad to show you that it's completed (what you see is the evening variation, although I also have a night and morning variation as well.):
Image
And lastly, I have two more background sketches to show!
Image

Image
So, in terms of art and programming, I'm doing good. Hopefully this week I'll be able to get more done in terms of writing!

Stay tuned! P:
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Re: Movement [GxG] [Drama]

#14 Post by Mad Harlequin » Sun Sep 28, 2014 1:23 pm

I approve of the new title and logo, and I love that background! It reminds me of The Adventures of Tintin for some reason. Maybe it's because of the pleasant sketchiness of your art style.
I'm an aspiring writer and voice talent with a passion for literature and an unhealthy attachment to video games. I am also a seasoned typo-sniper. Inquiries are encouraged. Friendly chats are welcome.
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Re: Movement [GxG] [Drama]

#15 Post by meiri » Sun Sep 28, 2014 8:44 pm

Mad Harlequin wrote:I approve of the new title and logo, and I love that background! It reminds me of The Adventures of Tintin for some reason. Maybe it's because of the pleasant sketchiness of your art style.
Thank you! :)
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