is there a point in making foreign language games?

[Der Tor]

As you might remember, i allready tried to make a german kinetic novel some time back, but gave up halfway through. Partially cause the story was WAY too gigantic for me to handle and i lacked the experience and partially cause i realized that even if i did finish it, nobody would propably download at it anyway.

But now my girlfriend wrote that wonderfull story which just cries "Visual Novel!" So i thought of giving it a try again.
But her story again is almost as long as the story i gave up on and again it is in german.

So i still think it is unrealistic for me to do it, cause it's still the same: even if i would succeed, i could'nt think of an easy way to make it being played by many people - since there exists no german speaking community for renai games.

So i am unsure about it, cause i don't wanna put in a lot of effort and than realize that it was pointless cause nobody knows about it.

But i am not gonna give up... i propably do a small german (or even swabian) game after all, see how it goes and if the feedback is good i'll do the big ones.

So that brings me to 2 requests i have for you folks:

1. would it be possible to make a section for foreign games on the Renai Archive in the future

2. since i wanna start with somethin very small for practice - does anyone have a good idea for a small game in German or Swabian? I could also translate an allready finished (very small) game into german or swabian (-:

[parvenue]

I'm sure that there is a German audience for visual novels. There's Felix, Gaijin, which proves that much. Of course, I can't read German so I don't exactly know how well-received it was...judging by the response on LSF, it did well. So, go ahead and make your game in German and tell the story that you want to tell. When the story's told, nothing's pointless in the end. If you want to get the VN out there, post it around nice German anime/manga boards. Reach your audience in other ways.

There are a few short game ideas in the "Ideas Dump" thread that you could probably use.

[Enerccio]

I kinda don't like noneglish language vn only... since those who can't speak that language can't play that vn. Therefore it would be really nice to have both version, eng and foreigner I think...

[monele]

The problem is that it's *hard* to translate something... especially when it gets medium-sized (even translating a one hour VN is *not* fun :/...). I'd love to release stuff in French because I'd write faster and more naturally... but I know I can't translate the stuff (I have the capacity, I don't have the patience)... and I don't think anyone else would do such a thing for free.

If we had a team of multilingual translators, it would be pretty cool

[bloodywyvern]

If there's even one person to play the game then of course there's a *point* in making them, the problem thats evident is if it's *worth* it to make it. I would say yes, because Lemma Soft has people from all over...and if you do advertise for it on other boards that are mainly that language it can help a lot.

I suppose translating is much different, and harder then simply writing the game itself. Bypassing the limitations of language is hard enough when not having to adapt it to a new one >.>

[brigid]

I kinda don't like noneglish language vn only... since those who can't speak that language can't play that vn. Therefore it would be really nice to have both version, eng and foreigner I think...

The thing is that an english only version is limited only to those who can read English. I don't know that there are many free visual novels or ren'ai games for other languages (except maybe Japanese).

If you feel confident in the language you're using then I say go for it. But it might be nice to have an English version for the rest of us, too.

[denzil]

I think the difficulty of translating depends how well you know the languages you're translating from and to. So when I was translating from English to Czech it wasn't that hard (mikey helped me a lot though). The main problem with translating is that it's time consuming. And it takes a LOT of time to translate VN that's just 1 hour long. Doing something for free... well, you just have to like the game (or translating) quite bit to do it.
It's worth it? I don't really know. I haven't got much response for the translations I did, and that's not exactly motivating. Still there are games I would like to translate, so who knows.

[monele]

The way I see it : if I make a french game, I know there won't be much of an audience for it... and most of it is here and knows english. So just making a game in french feels like a waste of time... yet I write a lot more easily in that language (well, duh). So I'm still torn between going French, then English, knowing I won't have the patience to go through this (tested that with Utsukushii Planet... we saw the result)... or going English only, knowing it's harder to get into the writing since it's not as natural.
A very annoying situation

[mikey]

It's worth it? I don't really know. I haven't got much response for the translations I did, and that's not exactly motivating.

Hmmm... I think that the grattitude depends entirely on the popularity of the original. If you look also at the small doujin games that have been translated from Japanese, they don't get that much response either.

I think that in general, translating is very simple, you just need to know the language - the problem is always motivation, since translating can get very boring if you don't have some sort of motivation. For a game maker, the motivation is simple - he wants to make a game that is in his head, there is a personal connection. It's a much more difficult job than merely translating someone else's game, but it's easier for a typical person to get motivated on their own creations, rather than mirroring someone else's. Therefore, as a translator, you either pick the smaller ones to relax, or you pick a really popular project that ensures you the gratification at the end.

As far as I can tell, even with the relatively big response to Nattsu SK, there is still no awareness and no real fandom in CZ and SK. And if there is, it's the sort that usually prefers the big hits, rather than something doujinshish. So making a game exclusively in CZ or SK is not very practical - but if as a result I make my game in English instead, it's absolutely NOT because I want to have more popularity - at this level, even the reasonably big OELVN community does not give you anything resembling fame - it's very simply because I'd like to give the game to people who actually want it. I'm pretty sure that none of the SK players really wanted Nattsu in this way - it was a nice experience, interesting game - but it was something just given to them, to try and play and see.

Here you have a community that is happy when you finish the game, that appreciates the effort and that actually wants games like these. So when I make a new game, I'm not turning away from my native language because I'd get less response, I'm turning away because I want it to be with the people who will be able to like it. And sure, this means working in a non-native language, but it's still an effort that I think is easily justified on my side. I don't believe in selfish creating, really - and while I usually do make things my own way and will not be making a moe dating sim just because the majority of players thinks it's cool and I will have more chances to appear on someone's blog, it still doesn't mean I don't want to reach the proverbial one person which gives my work a meaning.

And with my native language, I'm afraid I will not reach anyone, such small is the community (if there is any)... or to put it differently, I have an incomparably greater chance of reaching someone if the game is in English - and as has been explained, considering the people that my game could reach in my native language, more or less the game would be able to reach them in English as well (as they typically do know English).

Also, friends. Sure, everyone is an individual, but I'm just thinking - if monele would make Magical Boutique 2 only in French well... I'd definitely ask why, because he must know that I will be dying to play the game, much like I would love to play just about every OELVN (and related). So why did he do that? I would (maybe this is too egoistic) feel like he doesn't want me to play it - it would somehow come across like this. One thing is making a game disregarding other people's opinions - this is fine by me, you are the maker, you make the choices. If I don't like the game, that's my problem. But denying the people the experience COMPLETELEY, that's something different - recalling the private release of the SVN project, I felt a bit like this - I like the diversity and individualism, but denying the experience will always feel a bit mean, or hard to understand.

Sometimes though, a non-English release can't be avoided, and these cases I can understand. If it's a project like Felix Gaijin, or (to finally get back to Der Tor's post) a project made from a large script that is not translated, these are all projects that can't be in English from the start - and in these cases it's more important that they are finished, than the fact that they should be in English.

You may argue that Der Tor can use his energy he would have put into his German story to make a new, English one. But I think in this case the creation of the VN has the priority - if it's really meant to be a VN, it should be one. Some things are inevitable and a VN that wants to be made shouldn't be denied its existence for the wrong reasons.

And in the end, there is always a chance that someone who will translate it to English. There should always be this hope.

[monele]

I was totally "english only!" only a month ago... but then I tried to write in a more lengthy style (like a book, not like a VN, not even like a NVL VN) and it worked very well... but in French. And I have a hard time turning back to extremely short sentences ... It's even worse than that : I feel the ideas (not just the words) come more easily when writing in French... I did think "start in french, and then write it in english"... but in the end, that's really equal to translating.

mikey, how do you do it?

[mikey]

I often make my notes in Slovak, especially when it's a complicated thing, I guess it's normal to revert to native when things get too complex - or hectic, when I have an idea and need to put it down quickly. It's like when you count you almost always end up using your native language ^_^.

So yes, it takes more effort to write really long texts in English than what it would take to write them in Slovak. But it only means that long texts in English take me longer and demand more concentration - I try to avoid writing bits of text in Slovak so I don't have to translate my own text, and in the end, try to think in English when writing. This is all I can do, I guess.

[Wintermoon]

FWIW I would read it (in Standartdeutsch oder Schwäbisch).

[Adorya]

There is only one possible solution : to improve your english skillz at writing (which mean improving english writing AND english writing style which include cultural english style...). The lazy way is to read a lot of english book and the hard way is to take classes.

Currently I am on a Pratchett trend and I read some fantasy authors but I know I should better fix my english common mistakes...orz

[monele]

Well, I'm reading english gamebooks these days... so that can't be bad eh? ^^

[Vatina]

Currently I am on a Pratchett trend

That's how I learned english in the first place

But yes, I can see the problem. Maybe I would be able to write much better in my native language as well, but no one would ever read it - so I continue with my mediocre english writing skills instead.

I do mostly what mikey already mentioned. My notes and ideas are in danish, while the actual writing of scenes is always in english. Actually almost all story dialogue turns into english inside my head everytime I think about writing, it's a little troublesome sometimes ^^;