Lemma Soft Forums

Hi everybody!

I'm finally starting to dominate the program emofuri (or e-mote movie maker)! It is very difficult, all menus and manuals are in Japanese and you have to look for tutorials. I got to make some interesting sprites on it, which I might submit here later. You guys probably know what it's possible to do in that program -- briefly, you turn your drawing sprites into 3D!

I want to know something from you guys -- especially programmers -- .How interesting is emofuri for you VN project? Is it easy to program with emofuri sprites? Do you think more people would engage in a VN that has been animated with emofuri?

And last but not least, would you buy (or be interested in) randomly designed emofuri sprites for sale? I've been thinking of making a bunch of those and selling them at approximately $30 each (very accessible, right?) but they would have only the basics; no arms animation, but a considerable amount of possible expressions.

As long as I know, making commercial projcts with emofuri is allowed. Isn't it? ' - '

Awaiting your answers!

As a consumer, I'm extremely excited. So far I've only seen Nekopara having animations and it looked AMAZING! The animations for every sprite are so lively. Even just the bouncy idle is so very charming. Though I'm not man enough to play a game like that.

As a creator however, it doesn't do much for me. I don't think I'll ever be in a position where I can pay someone enough to create a cast of fully animated characters and I don't intend to buy stock character sprites for my projects. At least not the ones I'm passionate for. Though that is just me, I'm sure there's a market for it. If I ever have the budget to pay an animator though I'd be ON TOP of this.

Also, as a programmer, I can't imagine it's too difficult. I'm not experienced with Python and Renpy, but as with any programming language I'm sure I could force it in one way or another. Once you got that done it's not much different from scripting static sprites (depending on how you use them).

it only works in windows (why u no understand the value of apple and linux users), also i don't think it will be that popular considering that we can just do it without one. not many VN use live animation sprites in fact it takes time to make 8 of them.

bottom line, nope i dont care about it and also the free version cant be used for commercial use, its also not free its a trial version.

What is the difference between Q1.E-mote the official version and Emofuri?

E-mote the official version, and the editor of making a character, and we offer SDK to play the character on the application, a support service in a set of 1-year contract period. The official version from the extracted only editor of the function, the one that is published as a trial version for free, will be "Emofuri".

In addition, with enhanced video output function than "Emofuri", "E-mote Movie Maker" is also a one-year contract version of the support there, and we offer a paid indefinitely version without support.

ya nothing good is ever free QQ

Coming from an enthusiast standpoint... of course I'm interested. Anything that improves sprite aesthetics is welcome, and any visual novel that features emofuri would have that extra draw towards it.

Buuut... you also have to balance it from a developer standpoint, which involves doing some actual cost/reward analysis to determine if it's useful enough to be worth the resources. And as an independent developer without the backing of a publisher or guaranteed marketing, I can't envision any possible project of mine that would benefit. It's different if you have those extra resources at hand, but for most people it just won't be worth the effort.

I'd love to include Live2D into games, if and when Ren'py gets Live2D support.

I'm a Mac user...so...not interested in things I can't use.

I agree with Ozitiho, choosing between a custom sprite and an animated stock one, I'd choose the first. But if you offer animated sprites for commission some people might be interested.

Oh, good point. Commissions might be a great idea. You'd probably have to anime a whole cast, but I've seen great VN's with a total cast of one, so that might not be too bad.

I don't want to be a negative Nelly here, but I personally think Emofuri is effort in the wrong direction; a lot of time is spent animating characters that are still only going to be standing around in the middle of the screen doing nothing. If anything, that makes the contrast with static CGs more jarring. It's not a technique that expands the range of stories we can tell, so is it worth going through all the extra trouble?

firecat wrote:it only works in windows (why u no understand the value of apple and linux users), also i don't think it will be that popular considering that we can just do it without one. not many VN use live animation sprites in fact it takes time to make 8 of them.

bottom line, nope i dont care about it and also the free version cant be used for commercial use, its also not free its a trial version.

What is the difference between Q1.E-mote the official version and Emofuri?

E-mote the official version, and the editor of making a character, and we offer SDK to play the character on the application, a support service in a set of 1-year contract period. The official version from the extracted only editor of the function, the one that is published as a trial version for free, will be "Emofuri".

In addition, with enhanced video output function than "Emofuri", "E-mote Movie Maker" is also a one-year contract version of the support there, and we offer a paid indefinitely version without support.

ya nothing good is ever free QQ

Well, that's interesting! I thought it wouldn't be for free, after all. This world works like that, after all. Hahahaha O A O! Thank you for your information!

I get everyone's point. It's very pretty, but every time I played nekopara (it's visually cute and colorful but the story sucks, I think I'm never playing it again hahahah), I thought how much work Sayori had drawing those sprites, and that might have been too much effort. Also, if you look more closely, you will notice that they don't move a lot. That's probably the way she found so that not many mistakes would be shown.

So I have decided! I think I will be opening commission for these sprites, some people might be interested after all. I'm not hoping that they will sell, but that would be extra money for me, I guess! ~ Thank you everyone!

Sayuui wrote:It's very pretty, but every time I played nekopara (it's visually cute and colorful but the story sucks, I think I'm never playing it again hahahah)

Haha, guess you couldn't ask too much going in a story about a guy living together with two cat girl maids. We're totally on the same page here though. And hey, good on you for opening commissions! I hope it becomes popular and we'll see more animated sprites around.

Carassaurat wrote:I don't want to be a negative Nelly here, but I personally think Emofuri is effort in the wrong direction; a lot of time is spent animating characters that are still only going to be standing around in the middle of the screen doing nothing.

I actually disagree with this. You're suggesting that with the current technique even an animated character is only going to be standing around in the middle of the screen? If so, this is a shortcoming of the creator, not the technique. There are lots of things you can do with your sprites to make them seem more lifelike and in front of you. Mainly using well planned out transitions and positioning you can make it appear as if you're in first person view, seeing a person move in front of you. Even without animation. That is to say, adding animation to this is exactly what we need to make characters look even more lively.

Lastly, I'm a bit curious about the people saying it's not compatible with Mac. That's the just the program itself, right? I'm sure even though you can't make them you can still use them. So what's there not to be excited about?

I wouldn't find Nekopara's animations so interesting if they weren't catgirls, I think. EARS MOVING hits me in a cute spot.

I'd love to have access to more mobile characters, but I have enough trouble finding artists as it is, and I don't know how to hook that sort of thing into RenPy atm, so...

Ozitiho wrote:I actually disagree with this. You're suggesting that with the current technique even an animated character is only going to be standing around in the middle of the screen? If so, this is a shortcoming of the creator, not the technique. There are lots of things you can do with your sprites to make them seem more lifelike and in front of you. Mainly using well planned out transitions and positioning you can make it appear as if you're in first person view, seeing a person move in front of you. Even without animation. That is to say, adding animation to this is exactly what we need to make characters look even more lively.

I don't personally perceive a lack of 'liveliness' as a problem; or if I do, it's not because there's no movement. A painting does not move, but that does not hurt its ability to tell a story. There's no reason that still images should be inferior to moving ones. What I would suggest is that we'd be better off making quicker and efficient sprites so that we can have more of them, than we are with spending a lot of effort in making boring sprites look very fancy. I mean, look at Nekopara: we can all tell that it has a budget that's ten times that of any LSF member, right? But when its characters sit down and stand up, that has to be told through text. When two characters are lying on the sofa, they're presented as standing in front of you, and the text has to tell you that they're lying down. I don't think there's something necessarily bad about Emofuri, but there are a hundred visual issues that visual novels would be better off spending more solving than with breathing animations.

Carassaurat wrote:But when its characters sit down and stand up, that has to be told through text. When two characters are lying on the sofa, they're presented as standing in front of you, and the text has to tell you that they're lying down. I don't think there's something necessarily bad about Emofuri, but there are a hundred visual issues that visual novels would be better off spending more solving than with breathing animations.

Such as sitting down and standing up, or do you mean something else?

I agree with you completely that I find no fault in still images, and I don't think animated sprites will inherently improve the look of a game - Nekopara would have still looked stellar in static sprites, because it has an amazingly good illustrator - and I think that relying on them to achieve higher visual fidelity is an ill-conceived idea. Especially since they take so much time to do well. Until you can make a game of static sprites look as good as Nekopara or some such high budget VN, investing time in e-mote and emofuri is a waste of resources, in my opinion.

FRIEND!


i'm also a live 2D artist! i work with Cubism app (their website is live2d.com) because i like it's terms of usage more than emofuri
there's a learning curve to both of them, i started out with emofuri but switched to cubism because it's nearly impossible to get just the one frame you want to export in emofuri!
cubism is like: export image as transparent PNG? done
i wish there was support to import the animated mesh into Renpy, i think with the right expressions, even static characters can make more complicated emotions.
some of the comments on this thread assume that it is only used to make characters looking at you (the player) but it's actually just an animating app, it can do whatever you want it to do. i've seen people use it in wide-angle scenery shots of forests and water, they make music videos with it, they make characters who walk to the left or right!
i don't know how much of it was post-processing, but it's possible.
it's just that it is geared towards production of characters because that's the current rage in gaming in Japan (especially on smart phones because it is interactive)

Do you think more people would engage in a VN that has been animated with emofuri?

i would! it seems to me like technology that isn't yet implemented where it should be, it has so much potential but the support it has in other systems/programs is still too small
the community is also very small and not a lot of users are creating tutorials or offering free samples (even at a lower quality than commission work) so it's not easy to find your footing on where to begin!
there's some links in my signature you might enjoy reading through, we talk about emofuri and live 2d with renpy and learn together

It's not a technique that expands the range of stories we can tell, so is it worth going through all the extra trouble?

i actually think it would, because it's not limited to human face making.
in theory, it should reduce the amount of objects needed to make tactical RPGs on Renpy since you draw the item once and just stretch and bounce and animate it however you want. you want little people on tiny goats? sure! you want tanks with retracting canons? easy. a castle in the background pulling it's feet up from the ground and walking away? uhhh sure
i imagine it would also make better dress up games since Renpy can remember the choice of clothes and the live2d app will apply all the expressions as per usual, instead of having to create special statements and folders for every item of clothing the player chose and then redraw the sprite wearing those clothes in every pose you need.
you can make a character sit down, if you can draw it yourself or your artist is paid enough, it's actually pretty simple to switch legs and arms in those apps.
with the right expressions, you can even tell a story with just conversation (no need for novel-style narration that some players don't want to read) because you could just show that the character is swinging their arms in boredom, avoiding eye contact, or looking this way and that in embarrassment without an anime blush etc

you can even make stories that don't look like your normal VN because you're not restricted to the character being waist-up in the center, considering the rest of her body is cut off. just commission a whole body paper doll and zoom in and out in renpy, zoom however you like to show the character coming closer or further away, left or right or leaving the screen or walking in
you can make picture-book style stories with swaying/moving objects on the screen, this way even children can read the stories and look at the illustrations however they like instead of having to follow the pace of a video.
you can use the lip sync option and create a whole story with justa sprite and someone's voice, i don't know how that would be implemented in renpy code-wise since it would depend on what aspects can be supported by an SDK if there ever was any

according to the development updates on Cubism, the new versions will support lighting and shadow from the program itself. so you will only ever need one sprite for your scene, and when it becomes morning, evening or night, just change the shading/lighting and go with it. no need to repaint the whole character or change lighting for every time of day in your game. you will be able to make glass objects like glowing lanterns and crystal balls, maybe even reflective objects (i'm hoping, since the demo only showed light-reflecting objects)

i've love to add actual examples of all of the above but i don't want to hijack the thread

sooo sorry for the wall of text i just really like this technology!