Kinjo wrote:Yeah, I'd say you're right. Vegeta is actually a really good example. Why was he such a bad guy during the Saiyan Saga? This scene explains his motivations -- he was simply being used by Frieza ("Destroy Frieza. He made me what I am. Don't let him do it to anyone else"). That's probably what makes Vegeta such a great character, is that he's not really that evil, he was just in an unfortunate situation and had to make "evil" choices just to survive.
*Laughs like a wiseass about to lecture*
You say that as if Akira Toriyama already knew Freeza existed when he made the Sayian saga. Monkeys killed by rocks my friend, monkeys killed by rocks.
P.S. Freeza rules you.
Seriously though, whether it was with or without Freeza, Vegeta would've been evil. HIs entire society was, from the perspective of others. Freeza just conquered them and then destroyed them. Which, considering it was on Beerus's command, might actually mean that Freeza is more of a good guy than the Sayians. Certainly made for a higher mortal rating, that's for sure.
JupiterMercury wrote:I've heard arguments made that Shonen villains like those in DBZ and Jojo can be complicated as much as dramatic shows but I think the difference between them results in nuanced complexities. As you mentioned Breaking Bad involves the dramatic actions in a morally grey direction and I think the best example is the conflict between Walter White and Gus Fringe. In DBZ, I think a good example( unless I'm wrong) for strong internal conflict could be Goku and Majin Vegeta in the Buu saga. For Vegeta in that arc there seemed to be a callback to his status as a villain before becoming Goku's ally and then becoming evil again to reclaim a sense of pride that has been "decayed" by his life with Bulma and Trunks but Goku especially. Do I seem to make sense in a way?
Its not necessarily the grey area, rather than the existence of said grey area. With your story too, you could literally create the being in a way that makes them inherently good or evil without being bound to more realistic issues. In Breaking Bad, there are laws in place that make meth illegal because the government says so and meth makes a lot of money because that's the way the world works. In a story of gods, such higher powers dictating what is and isn't are your characters rather than the indebatable ones above you. You're the minions fighting while having to have the opinions of your masters.
JupiterMercury wrote:Right now the story is at a rudimentary level so I'm still trying to make them connect. However it's an sea adventure story that Moby Dick meets a legend that I read in a mythology book plus the otome genre. The two villains in my story are an eldritch abomination sea creature that wrecks havoc on a fishing village and a demigod that's the descendant of the main protagonist's divine form before her descent into an oceanpunk Earth.
The latter's goal(Demigod) is to use the sea creature and kill as many villagers as possible to make them pray to the deity he serves so that the deity (who's been unhappy since his consort(The MC's true identity) left and has neglected all creation) can reclaim the main protagonist. Anyone who tries to capture or kill(and that includes the romantic options) are obstacles to the demigod's goals so he tries to kill them ( but sparing her while slowly killing the others) while sailing with four of them as the MC develops a romance with the option the player chooses.
I see. Just like with DBZ, that means his motivations and evil can be purely based upon his creation, and his mentality based upon his superior power compared to the humans. This is not a human killing humans, this is a human killing rats. That makes a difference, even if the rats were to disagree.
Considering this is a creation of the MC and the above-antagonist, that does make for a potential interesting dynamic. The antagonist might not ever be swayed by the words of mortals, but the exact same words by the MC could have effect on him. Thus giving the MC power that none other has, without giving her actual physical powers.
Or he could be a case of an agent not made for their purpose. They were f.e. made as a butler to serve, never to use their own judgement or be in command. Thus evil because their plan doesn't work or because of shortsightedness.
Or he could be a pure and perfect being that starts to change due to their descent to a mortal coil, thus perfect in core but corrupted purely and alone by the actions and events of the story.
These are just a few suggestions that can apply to a villain in this situation, chosen to give easy villain motives rather than to fit in a plot. Feel free to ignore.
JupiterMercury wrote:Whenever the demigod reveals his true identity, depending on who you romanced, the motivation will veer in the motif of the option you chose. Right now, I've thought of having a naturalist, pirate, soldier, and a fisherman as the options.
The challenge is trying to make all the motivations in each path coalesce into one comprehensive motivation that gives the full picture of his character. The demigod tries to reunite them out of love for his master and for his mother who he thinks is being disgraced and exploited by having a mortal life. What the demigod wants most is his parents to be together again.
That's indeed a good motivation, as a servant and minion that would be the most relateable and logical drive for his actions. And I can see them having an issue with each of the LI's based upon their simplest description. The soldier is the mortal's pride to overthrow even the gods themselves (perhaps there's been an invasion of the godly realm like in Greek mythology?), the fisherman reaps from nature and breaks the balance for their own gain in what will eventually result in the exhaustion of sea life, the pirate is pretty obvious and naturalist depends on what you've got planned for that one.
Getting all those routes coherent with one another is indeed a challenge. Perhaps he focusses on the LI because MC focussed on him. But to do it coherent with one antoher might indeed be a challenge. I myself added 4 antagonists, a basic one that will always attack you and one for each of the three LI's. The other two are actually supporting the MC based upon their ideology which is either positive or neutral to the LI you chose, meaning you always have one enemy, one friend and one on the sidelines. But whether that works depends on the story, of course.